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welcome to the show higher side shatters

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what a wonderful day it is drinking a

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little drink smoking a little smoke

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I'm your hazy host Greg Carl wood and

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today I'm flying solo for a talk with a

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man who's been researching the

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alternative side of things for over two

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decades and that man is Ken Thomas ken

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prefers to call his area of research

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pair of politics as opposed to the

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loaded term conspiracy theories and he

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is a man the man behind the popular

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steam shovel press publication and has

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authored over a dozen conspiracy and

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paranormal books of his own including

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NASA Nazis and JFK JFK and UFO and his

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newest Kindle book popular pair of

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politics he's done more conspiracy

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research than I've done breathing and

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I'm damn proud to present him to you

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today Ken welcome to my stupid stoner

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show okay thank you very much my

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pleasure and you know I myself have been

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interested in conspiracy for some time

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and I started out as a student of the

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David Ickes and Jordan Maxwell's and I

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really didn't know much about the work

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of so many other people until I met Adam

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go rightly and he introduced me to a

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whole new set of great researchers

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yourself included so lately I feel like

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I'm a kid in a conspiracy field candy

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store you know Adam go right leaves

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where my gurus actually I have this

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whole scheme to wrestle Jesse Ventura in

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the ring that I will secretly put a mask

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on go rightly and put him in the ring in

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my place writer one of the cool things

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is that he he contributed a chapter to a

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book of mine called secret and

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suppressed - in about Tuesday Weld yes a

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television actress who may have also

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been some kind of high priestess in a

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druidic cult yeah we actually had

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Douglas Hawes in the show not long ago

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exactly what do you think of the Jeff

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Turner story since we're on the topic

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well

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lecturing because one of the things I'm

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doing is demonstrating how the Kennedy

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assassination was telegraphed in advance

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a year in advance on national television

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in a program called route 66 yes and

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there's an episode of route 66 that has

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Tuesday Weld as the star she's like 18

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years old and it has all of these weird

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things in it because this is again this

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came out in 1962 a year before the

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assassination and the two guys route 66

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the premises basically Kerouac and

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Cassady driving across the country and

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the premise that this one is they drive

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into a fictional town then is right

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outside of Dallas they drive past the

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highway sign this is Dallas Waco and the

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name of the town is Kilkenny oh man

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and Tuesday Weld character I forget her

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name but it's a mm it's like a Marilyn

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Monroe thing an anagram and also we have

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photographs of George Maharis his

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brother George Maharis played one of the

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the two guys who played the neal cassady

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figure but his brother we have pictures

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of his brother partying at Jack Ruby's

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carousel club during the making of these

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show so there's always Kennedy

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connections and you could call him

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synchronicities but where they basically

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are predictions more forecasts of what's

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gonna happen but at the same time

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there's this subplot about how Tuesday

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Weld was abandoned as a young child and

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her sister like ties her to a tree and

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there's this this tree looks like you

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know the whole thing looks like a grew

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it occult so it's all into what Gina

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Jeff Hawes was saying and Adam had an

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essay

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yeah it's it was definitely an

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interesting topic I mean it all hinges

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on the thoughts and ideas of one man

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which makes it kind of you know but I

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mean yeah there's definitely seems to be

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other links throughout the world that

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show that this could be the case as far

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as as your research is concerned I mean

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a little piece of Ken Thomas history

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that I really liked was that your

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publication steam shovel press it

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started with an interview with ROM das

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can you tell us a bit about that oh yeah

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richard alpert who is Timothy Leary's

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partner

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at Harvard before they both got fired

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for giving undergraduate students LSD

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and and you know Tim Leary went on to

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great Fame on his own kind of developing

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the science of neurologic but Richard

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Albert kind of dropped out he went to

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the east he got a guru in India and he

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changed his name to Baba Ram Dass and

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he's fascinating man very interesting

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guy and I was working for the newspapers

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here in town and I had this one

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assignment he was coming to town so I

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had this assignment go do an interview

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with him and I did and I swear I almost

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became enlightened man we had a fabulous

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interview it was great but then when I

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did it I am you know typed up the

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transcript and was you know ready to

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turn it in and get paid for it and they

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decided to nix it because at that point

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Ron Doss had already gone you know he

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came he did his lecture and I did my

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interview and he was gone and so the

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newspaper figured there's nothing there

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to promote so therefore we won't use it

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and I'm like oh my god I've got this

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famous interview with this brilliant man

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and you know it's gonna go to waste and

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it wasn't just about the money because I

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you know I build them a kill fee so I

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created the small magazine this is like

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in 1988 Wow before a lot of your

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listeners were born all that yeah I was

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I was three years old oh yes so yeah so

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I needed to put it somewhere so I

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created this small magazine nothing much

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more than a like I said I didn't pay for

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it anything I got above and beyond that

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it was simply just a matter of taking

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some good work and making sure that

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somebody else got to see it besides

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besides me and Ron das so at that point

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that then that became kind of a

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catch-all for everything that I wasn't

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getting paid for but then I had an

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intense interest in that you know I

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couldn't for instance shortly thereafter

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I became fascinated by Wilhelm Reich a

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naturalist scientist in the 1950s we

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have our own energy

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and so I was writing stuff about that

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and you know there's there was no reason

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here to to get it published although

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interestingly enough just today I was

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writing a tribute thing for Jim Mosely

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who used to publish saucer smear and he

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died recently and Tim Beckley's putting

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the others collection of people's

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thoughts and going through the research

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on this I discovered I forgot about this

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but I discovered at one point here in

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town one of the local radio sports

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anchors was killed by her husband after

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the guy read listen little man by

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wilhelm reich so that's this weird

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murder connected to reich but this was

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of course before steam shovel press

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number two which was a compilation

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basically of my research right up until

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then and then the third part the third

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issue

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I spoke to I'm Yuri Baraka who is like

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the only black member of The Beat

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Generation his name is Leroy Jones he

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changed it to Amiri Baraka and I did an

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interview with him and that interview

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actually got published but there was

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more to it than got published so then I

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put that and at that point what was

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going on in the subculture of conspiracy

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research was that may Brussels died may

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Brussels was right the mainland the

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queen of conspiracy theories the Guru of

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us all she died and the major journal

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that was being published at that time

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called critique the publisher there

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found a guru of his own self-help guy

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named Robert lemasters so critique was

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changed to living fire and it all became

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the homilies of this this New Age guru

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so that was gone maybe Brussels was gone

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pratik was gone and it just you know it

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just seemed to me that the whole thing

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was falling apart the whole idea that

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there is a subculture of critically

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thinking people that can see through the

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crap that the mainstream media tries to

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put out there and try to dig at the

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little conspiracies that are actually

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going on seems to me that was

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disappearing and that was just too big

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of a tragedy to happen to to to let

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happen so of course at that point I put

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in a call for papers and the

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the last page of steam cello press

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number three and I said I describe the

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situation conspiracies we need to write

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about conspiracies I want to hear from

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you I want to continue to produce this

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this magazine only we're gonna instead

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of just you know being things that fall

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out of my regular work I'm going to to

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do a directed thing to make some kind of

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conspiracy publication gadfly

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publication still remained out there

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very cool I mean it seems like you've

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been going strong ever since and for

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people who aren't that familiar with

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your work it seems that your current

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focus has been this link between the

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lesser-known Maury island UFO case and

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the assassination of JFK is subject to

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your one year more recent books JFK and

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UFO and I had never heard of the Maury

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island case until I started looking into

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you and it's a great one so if you'd be

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so kind

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give the people a little lesson on the

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Maury Island incident 101 yeah not

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knowing much about Maury island there's

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only been one book on the subject there

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was an early edition of my book but the

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book that I have out now is the only one

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that goes into detail and the basic the

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big headline underneath it all that you

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would think would attract many more

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people is that the guy that was

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responsible for the initial UFO cover-up

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when the UFOs they started seeing UFOs

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in the late 40s the guy who is

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responsible for the cover-up is most

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likely the grassy knoll shooter in the

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Kennedy assassination I mean it's not

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you know there's quite nothing it's good

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and the historic trail is as solid on

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that as almost anything that you're

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gonna read in a history book

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Maureen Island happened in 1947 a few

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days before Kenneth Arnold started they

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saw his he was he was flying over Mount

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Ranier and he saw these Chevron shaped

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craft and that was the beginning of the

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modern UFO period supposedly that's when

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after that is when the wave when people

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started seeing them all over but three

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days before that there was this instant

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instance out in a harbor near there in

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Tacoma Washington in Puget Sound where

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these guys in a boat

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it was a salvage

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in lumbering you know they chop down

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trees and they transport them through

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waterways and every once in a while the

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trees a tree will break loose you know

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they're like branded and stuff all right

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but a tree will break loose so these

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guys I mean they weren't government

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people they were losers a privately run

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00:11:33,750 --> 00:11:30,550
Harbor boat that would go and salvage

273
00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:33,760
these logs and check out the brand and

274
00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:36,010
take it back to the logging company and

275
00:11:39,420 --> 00:11:38,170
collect a reward that's how they made

276
00:11:43,620 --> 00:11:39,430
their living so they're doing this one

277
00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:43,630
day and these saucer-shaped things show

278
00:11:50,580 --> 00:11:47,770
up above Puget Sound there's like a half

279
00:11:52,860 --> 00:11:50,590
a dozen of them the are all circling one

280
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:52,870
that is wobbling one's having trouble up

281
00:11:58,980 --> 00:11:54,970
there and it starts spewing out some

282
00:12:02,220 --> 00:11:58,990
junk onto the boat and the boat is owned

283
00:12:04,410 --> 00:12:02,230
by a guy named Harold Dahl his son is on

284
00:12:05,820 --> 00:12:04,420
the boat with him and their dog is on

285
00:12:08,790 --> 00:12:05,830
the boat with him and a couple of other

286
00:12:11,370 --> 00:12:08,800
people the son gets struck by some of

287
00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:11,380
the slag and his arm gets hurt the dog

288
00:12:16,590 --> 00:12:13,770
actually gets killed by some of it and

289
00:12:18,270 --> 00:12:16,600
they have this whole incident and then

290
00:12:20,130 --> 00:12:18,280
you know one of the saucers taps the

291
00:12:22,140 --> 00:12:20,140
wobbling one it straightens up and they

292
00:12:24,030 --> 00:12:22,150
all fly away they have to take the boy

293
00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:24,040
to the hospital yeah that's the little

294
00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:28,330
dog under though it's the harbor and you

295
00:12:33,060 --> 00:12:30,730
know they come really totally freaked

296
00:12:36,180 --> 00:12:33,070
out I always hear this stuff described

297
00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:36,190
as slag but what what is that well there

298
00:12:44,940 --> 00:12:37,930
are two substances a white and a black

299
00:12:48,570 --> 00:12:44,950
one and a rock like material that was

300
00:12:50,430 --> 00:12:48,580
really superheated when it struck the

301
00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:50,440
boat and struck these people okay I'm

302
00:12:55,260 --> 00:12:52,570
kind of like molten metal like mobile

303
00:12:57,660 --> 00:12:55,270
but but it but hardens enough that they

304
00:12:59,670 --> 00:12:57,670
were able to collect samples because

305
00:13:02,190 --> 00:12:59,680
what Harold Dahl did at that point was

306
00:13:05,180 --> 00:13:02,200
he went to tell his partner in this

307
00:13:07,620 --> 00:13:05,190
harbor patrol boat business of his and

308
00:13:09,360 --> 00:13:07,630
even though the boat is registered in

309
00:13:11,940 --> 00:13:09,370
his name we've got the registration in

310
00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:11,950
the book the boss of the operation was

311
00:13:17,660 --> 00:13:14,250
his partner this guy named Fred Krisna

312
00:13:20,850 --> 00:13:17,670
and he goes to tell Chrisman and

313
00:13:22,690 --> 00:13:20,860
Chrisman comes down and says he sees a

314
00:13:25,570 --> 00:13:22,700
saucer himself

315
00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:25,580
resigning and but then but that one

316
00:13:30,940 --> 00:13:28,370
flies away but together they collect

317
00:13:33,430 --> 00:13:30,950
this flag so what has never happened you

318
00:13:35,050 --> 00:13:33,440
know was formless and huh you know it's

319
00:13:38,410 --> 00:13:35,060
described as hitting the water and

320
00:13:40,270 --> 00:13:38,420
releasing steam so it was hot okay okay

321
00:13:41,830 --> 00:13:40,280
I just wondered how because it seemed

322
00:13:44,620 --> 00:13:41,840
like a liquid and I wondered how they

323
00:13:46,270 --> 00:13:44,630
kept it in you say a Kellogg's box and

324
00:13:48,550 --> 00:13:46,280
also why would you keep something that

325
00:13:50,020 --> 00:13:48,560
killed your dog but I guess if it you

326
00:13:51,730 --> 00:13:50,030
know that makes sense if it was a heat

327
00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:51,740
thing and then it hardens and becomes

328
00:13:55,090 --> 00:13:53,090
you know something you can carry in a

329
00:13:57,220 --> 00:13:55,100
box well you have to remember this is

330
00:13:58,420 --> 00:13:57,230
before the UFO wave there's not gonna be

331
00:14:00,160 --> 00:13:58,430
the weirdest thing that ever happened to

332
00:14:02,110 --> 00:14:00,170
these guys that's also another good

333
00:14:03,820 --> 00:14:02,120
point as to why you know it'll to the

334
00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:03,830
legitimacy of it you know he's not he

335
00:14:07,180 --> 00:14:05,210
doesn't have a lot of references for

336
00:14:09,610 --> 00:14:07,190
craft in the sky that he could just try

337
00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:09,620
to be getting popular off of right right

338
00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:11,450
exactly they're just collecting this

339
00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:14,210
stuff because you know it's supposedly

340
00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:16,010
it's just a weird thing that happened to

341
00:14:20,290 --> 00:14:17,450
them and here's some proof of what it

342
00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:20,300
was and they did you know they said I

343
00:14:25,390 --> 00:14:22,250
didn't realize at the time that Kenneth

344
00:14:28,570 --> 00:14:25,400
Arnold himself was hired to investigate

345
00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:28,580
their story and that's where they took

346
00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:30,290
the Kellogg's cornflakes that's where

347
00:14:35,590 --> 00:14:31,730
fredchristman took the Kellogg's

348
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:35,600
cornflakes box and and Dahl brought

349
00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:37,130
samples and they show them to Arnold

350
00:14:41,410 --> 00:14:38,570
they told him this story I showed him

351
00:14:43,540 --> 00:14:41,420
the area and in Arnold didn't know what

352
00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:43,550
to make of it either so he called the

353
00:14:47,860 --> 00:14:45,890
Air Force the the newly formed Air Force

354
00:14:49,900 --> 00:14:47,870
actually the Air Force hadn't existed so

355
00:14:53,770 --> 00:14:49,910
like almost right at this moment but

356
00:14:57,610 --> 00:14:53,780
these two investigators Davidson and

357
00:14:58,930 --> 00:14:57,620
Braun came from you know representatives

358
00:15:03,040 --> 00:14:58,940
of the Air Force came out talked to

359
00:15:05,050 --> 00:15:03,050
Arnold Arnold had Chrisman bring out his

360
00:15:08,500 --> 00:15:05,060
Kellogg's cornflakes box of the slack

361
00:15:10,330 --> 00:15:08,510
and he gave it to Davidson and Braun

362
00:15:11,710 --> 00:15:10,340
they would sit in Braun I don't know

363
00:15:14,110 --> 00:15:11,720
what to make of it either they put it on

364
00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:14,120
a b25 and they're gonna fly it back to

365
00:15:19,060 --> 00:15:16,370
wright-patterson Air Force Base to test

366
00:15:22,450 --> 00:15:19,070
it to see exactly what the heck is their

367
00:15:24,970 --> 00:15:22,460
plane crashes through some obvious act

368
00:15:29,470 --> 00:15:24,980
of sabotage both of those guys are

369
00:15:31,810 --> 00:15:29,480
killed and everything is dropped after

370
00:15:34,300 --> 00:15:31,820
that so fredchristman loads up this

371
00:15:36,140 --> 00:15:34,310
there's weird stuff on to the plane that

372
00:15:38,540 --> 00:15:36,150
crashes and kills these guys I

373
00:15:40,910 --> 00:15:38,550
and at that point from that point

374
00:15:43,010 --> 00:15:40,920
forward there is no real investigation

375
00:15:44,810 --> 00:15:43,020
of the mauryan in case there still is no

376
00:15:50,270 --> 00:15:44,820
real investigation of the Moylan case

377
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:50,280
upon I think it's a the low-five website

378
00:15:55,490 --> 00:15:52,650
I have this whole thing about it this is

379
00:15:57,110 --> 00:15:55,500
in Kelso Washington that an effort needs

380
00:15:59,000 --> 00:15:57,120
to be made to excavate this place

381
00:16:01,880 --> 00:15:59,010
because the plane crash is still there

382
00:16:04,220 --> 00:16:01,890
and we can still investigate it Wow

383
00:16:06,290 --> 00:16:04,230
but it's be fun yeah but it didn't

384
00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:06,300
happen then so Chrisman totally involved

385
00:16:14,810 --> 00:16:10,250
in the earliest of the UFO coverup

386
00:16:16,550 --> 00:16:14,820
operations and then boom you know 1963

387
00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:16,560
comes around charisma kind of disappears

388
00:16:23,210 --> 00:16:18,810
at that point and then he doesn't

389
00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:23,220
reappear until 1963 where he is grassy

390
00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:25,290
knoll shooter now I say he is and that's

391
00:16:29,990 --> 00:16:28,410
just that it's my opinion that he is

392
00:16:31,700 --> 00:16:30,000
although it is mine and other people

393
00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:31,710
would have other opinions but it is also

394
00:16:37,430 --> 00:16:34,650
the opinion of Jim Garrison and Jim

395
00:16:39,860 --> 00:16:37,440
Garrison is the only guy who took a

396
00:16:43,580 --> 00:16:39,870
prosecution to court over the Kennedy

397
00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:43,590
assassination he was the subject of the

398
00:16:48,470 --> 00:16:45,570
Oliver Stone movie most people you know

399
00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:48,480
who into the assassination from the

400
00:16:53,930 --> 00:16:50,850
early 90s forward know it through Oliver

401
00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:53,940
Stone's movie yes yeah and that's about

402
00:16:59,030 --> 00:16:55,770
Jim Garrison's case and Jim Garrison

403
00:17:01,610 --> 00:16:59,040
himself felt that fredchristman same guy

404
00:17:04,340 --> 00:17:01,620
involved in Moria was the grassy knoll

405
00:17:06,230 --> 00:17:04,350
shooter and what evidence is there to

406
00:17:08,510 --> 00:17:06,240
put him on the grassy knoll on that day

407
00:17:10,940 --> 00:17:08,520
there's photographic evidence for one

408
00:17:13,370 --> 00:17:10,950
thing that's that that'll do it yeah

409
00:17:16,670 --> 00:17:13,380
this uh you know a famous thing in the

410
00:17:18,620 --> 00:17:16,680
the JFK assassination law are the tramps

411
00:17:20,570 --> 00:17:18,630
the three tramps there were three tramps

412
00:17:23,360 --> 00:17:20,580
that were arrested in the rail yard

413
00:17:25,910 --> 00:17:23,370
behind the grassy knoll and kind of

414
00:17:27,590 --> 00:17:25,920
parading out and the photographs are

415
00:17:29,150 --> 00:17:27,600
interesting to me I mean these are two

416
00:17:30,830 --> 00:17:29,160
guys that they suspect might be involved

417
00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:30,840
in the assassination but you see them

418
00:17:35,390 --> 00:17:32,970
being walked through the street and you

419
00:17:37,100 --> 00:17:35,400
know the cops guns are facing down and

420
00:17:39,380 --> 00:17:37,110
it's all kind of a very casual thing and

421
00:17:43,340 --> 00:17:39,390
the identity of these these three tramps

422
00:17:45,670 --> 00:17:43,350
have been investigated and labeled as

423
00:17:48,250 --> 00:17:45,680
different people at different times but

424
00:17:51,460 --> 00:17:48,260
Garrison's point of view was that one

425
00:17:53,890 --> 00:17:51,470
the tramps was Christmas now I show this

426
00:17:55,510 --> 00:17:53,900
photographs in my lecture and pointed

427
00:17:56,950 --> 00:17:55,520
out side-by-side I could show you the

428
00:17:58,230 --> 00:17:56,960
one that looks like Christmas surely

429
00:18:00,760 --> 00:17:58,240
does look like him

430
00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:00,770
garrison took this photograph actually

431
00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:03,770
and this gets into popular pair of

432
00:18:09,010 --> 00:18:05,690
politics which is my book on pop culture

433
00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:09,020
conspiracy mmm-hmm but Jim Garrison went

434
00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:11,530
you know under the highly controversial

435
00:18:15,580 --> 00:18:13,730
investigation into an assassination that

436
00:18:17,620 --> 00:18:15,590
had been publicly closed

437
00:18:18,910 --> 00:18:17,630
you know the Warren Commission said it

438
00:18:21,250 --> 00:18:18,920
was a lone nut

439
00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:21,260
here's garrison you know got really

440
00:18:24,850 --> 00:18:23,570
famous and notorious for challenging

441
00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:24,860
that and so he gets on The Tonight Show

442
00:18:31,210 --> 00:18:28,610
with Johnny Carson and explains a few

443
00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:31,220
other things and at one point he takes

444
00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:32,810
out the tramps photographing he's just

445
00:18:37,390 --> 00:18:34,850
about ready to say this man here is

446
00:18:39,070 --> 00:18:37,400
fredchristman the giant Carson shuts him

447
00:18:42,310 --> 00:18:39,080
down before he can say is say it you

448
00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:42,320
know really yeah you know most of the a

449
00:18:46,360 --> 00:18:43,850
lot of the Carson shows were destroyed

450
00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:46,370
including that one but an audio copy of

451
00:18:50,290 --> 00:18:48,530
it exists so you can hear it happening

452
00:18:52,870 --> 00:18:50,300
you know I've got that and sometimes

453
00:18:56,170 --> 00:18:52,880
play at data collector but yeah Johnny

454
00:18:58,390 --> 00:18:56,180
Carson's was the man who prevented Fred

455
00:19:01,480 --> 00:18:58,400
kruseman's name of being nationally

456
00:19:04,060 --> 00:19:01,490
known as as the shooter it's interesting

457
00:19:07,180 --> 00:19:04,070
is that that whole situation is not was

458
00:19:09,550 --> 00:19:07,190
not in the original theatrical release

459
00:19:11,020 --> 00:19:09,560
of Oliver Stone's JFK movie but if you

460
00:19:12,730 --> 00:19:11,030
get the home versions now there is a

461
00:19:15,310 --> 00:19:12,740
scene that would have been cut out and

462
00:19:17,380 --> 00:19:15,320
John Larroquette plays to Johnny Carson

463
00:19:19,210 --> 00:19:17,390
figure and they reenact that whole thing

464
00:19:22,060 --> 00:19:19,220
whoa that's pretty awesome

465
00:19:24,570 --> 00:19:22,070
although Chrisman again is not really

466
00:19:27,340 --> 00:19:24,580
mentioned in Oliver Stone's movie either

467
00:19:29,860 --> 00:19:27,350
because remember Garrison's case was was

468
00:19:32,710 --> 00:19:29,870
not against Chrisman it was against a

469
00:19:34,330 --> 00:19:32,720
guy named clay Shaw garrison you know he

470
00:19:37,150 --> 00:19:34,340
figured Christmas it was a triggerman

471
00:19:39,460 --> 00:19:37,160
and he was trying to get at the actual

472
00:19:41,290 --> 00:19:39,470
conspirators the the power elements that

473
00:19:43,360 --> 00:19:41,300
were behind the whole thing right yeah

474
00:19:46,900 --> 00:19:43,370
and the only person that he could make a

475
00:19:48,730 --> 00:19:46,910
case against was this socialite named

476
00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:48,740
clay Shaw who did have some involvement

477
00:19:55,660 --> 00:19:51,650
with it but obviously you know it wasn't

478
00:19:57,460 --> 00:19:55,670
enough to convince a jury or garrison

479
00:19:58,690 --> 00:19:57,470
wasn't able to make the case but the

480
00:19:59,630 --> 00:19:58,700
final point to be made about that is

481
00:20:04,700 --> 00:19:59,640
that in you know

482
00:20:07,580 --> 00:20:04,710
happened in 1968 in 1977 the House of

483
00:20:10,030 --> 00:20:07,590
Representatives conducted another

484
00:20:13,940 --> 00:20:10,040
investigation into the assassination and

485
00:20:16,250 --> 00:20:13,950
it concluded that there was a conspiracy

486
00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:16,260
and that became the official and is

487
00:20:20,150 --> 00:20:18,330
still the official conclusion of the US

488
00:20:24,740 --> 00:20:20,160
government and that there was a

489
00:20:27,350 --> 00:20:24,750
conspiracy to the assassination that

490
00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:27,360
involved a conspiracy and and and the

491
00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:28,890
original Warren Commission conclusion is

492
00:20:32,360 --> 00:20:30,090
that there were three shots from the

493
00:20:33,860 --> 00:20:32,370
Book Depository was wrong because in

494
00:20:36,170 --> 00:20:33,870
those hearings it came up with a tape

495
00:20:39,710 --> 00:20:36,180
that demonstrated it was a fourth shot

496
00:20:41,330 --> 00:20:39,720
and and it was all still up in the air

497
00:20:42,950 --> 00:20:41,340
and they they turn those conclusions and

498
00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:42,960
nobody knows that either because at that

499
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:45,330
point when that happened it was buried

500
00:20:49,250 --> 00:20:46,650
in the backs of the newspapers across

501
00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:49,260
the country right and that's you bring

502
00:20:52,220 --> 00:20:50,370
up an interesting point something I

503
00:20:54,050 --> 00:20:52,230
wanted to talk about and it's all its in

504
00:20:55,190 --> 00:20:54,060
popular Peretz about politics one of the

505
00:20:57,770 --> 00:20:55,200
first things you talk about

506
00:20:59,540 --> 00:20:57,780
there were several reporters that said

507
00:21:01,220 --> 00:20:59,550
there were three shots now science has

508
00:21:02,660 --> 00:21:01,230
determined there were more people

509
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:02,670
investigating and determined there were

510
00:21:07,940 --> 00:21:04,650
more but it seems like the people who

511
00:21:10,370 --> 00:21:07,950
said the the presented narrative as it

512
00:21:12,590 --> 00:21:10,380
was meant to be on that day know

513
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:12,600
probably knowing it wasn't true or maybe

514
00:21:15,980 --> 00:21:14,730
maybe not but the people who were

515
00:21:17,420 --> 00:21:15,990
willing to say there were only three

516
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:17,430
shots fired they all seemed to have

517
00:21:21,350 --> 00:21:19,050
pretty prominent careers after that

518
00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:21,360
after telling that lie that's exactly

519
00:21:27,530 --> 00:21:22,890
right that's a really interesting point

520
00:21:30,260 --> 00:21:27,540
well you basically just take the press

521
00:21:31,850 --> 00:21:30,270
releases that come out of DC or from

522
00:21:34,870 --> 00:21:31,860
whatever authority and kind of reread it

523
00:21:36,620 --> 00:21:34,880
you know there's no there is no real

524
00:21:40,370 --> 00:21:36,630
investigative reporting going on

525
00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:40,380
anywhere on anything you know so the

526
00:21:44,870 --> 00:21:43,530
same been one of the big things that

527
00:21:46,970 --> 00:21:44,880
people look at when they see the

528
00:21:48,740 --> 00:21:46,980
Zapruder film is that his head tilts the

529
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:48,750
wrong way I mean that's that's the

530
00:21:52,940 --> 00:21:50,490
evidence to where the shot came from and

531
00:21:56,060 --> 00:21:52,950
you also tell a story of a reporter who

532
00:21:58,220 --> 00:21:56,070
was talking on the radio and purposely

533
00:22:00,230 --> 00:21:58,230
was deceptive about the direction of

534
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:00,240
Kennedy's head to make it fit a little

535
00:22:04,700 --> 00:22:02,850
cleaner with the official story and that

536
00:22:06,470 --> 00:22:04,710
man of course everybody would know today

537
00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:06,480
it would be dan Rather as dan Rather

538
00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:08,730
right right I have the audio of that too

539
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:10,770
I've got that in a tape loop where he's

540
00:22:15,140 --> 00:22:13,650
describing Kennedy falling forward

541
00:22:17,090 --> 00:22:15,150
fall for it he gets hit from the front

542
00:22:18,740 --> 00:22:17,100
and falls backward and you would think

543
00:22:20,750 --> 00:22:18,750
that if you were running a news network

544
00:22:22,730 --> 00:22:20,760
and someone couldn't tell the [\h__\h]

545
00:22:24,050 --> 00:22:22,740
direction of a person's head that you

546
00:22:25,340 --> 00:22:24,060
wouldn't want that person presenting

547
00:22:26,690 --> 00:22:25,350
information anymore they're not a

548
00:22:29,930 --> 00:22:26,700
credible source you think you'd get

549
00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:29,940
someone else at the time of course

550
00:22:36,770 --> 00:22:33,810
rather had no idea that the film itself

551
00:22:39,260 --> 00:22:36,780
was going to be presented on television

552
00:22:42,290 --> 00:22:39,270
it didn't get put on television till the

553
00:22:47,630 --> 00:22:42,300
years later when Dick Gregory and Robert

554
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:47,640
Groden brought it to who's that guy yeah

555
00:22:52,430 --> 00:22:50,610
Geraldo Rivera show ah yeah and that was

556
00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:52,440
the first time it was ever shown so so

557
00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:53,730
rather thinking that nobody's ever

558
00:22:58,360 --> 00:22:55,530
really gonna get to see this it's just a

559
00:23:02,030 --> 00:22:58,370
great thing is why about it right right

560
00:23:03,740 --> 00:23:02,040
funny thing funny thing but let's talk a

561
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:03,750
little bit more about fredchristman you

562
00:23:08,990 --> 00:23:05,730
know he's at this suppose at first UFO

563
00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:09,000
sighting you know in that time and then

564
00:23:13,490 --> 00:23:11,010
he's supposedly the grassy knoll shooter

565
00:23:15,530 --> 00:23:13,500
who is he like what what is his role who

566
00:23:17,990 --> 00:23:15,540
is he employed by are there any other

567
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:18,000
interesting things about him oh my god

568
00:23:23,690 --> 00:23:20,850
yeah well you know the book goes into

569
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:23,700
great detail Crispin is actually on the

570
00:23:29,990 --> 00:23:26,970
scene even before Maury island weirdly

571
00:23:32,660 --> 00:23:30,000
enough he was part of there were these

572
00:23:35,990 --> 00:23:32,670
pulp magazines published by Ray Palmer

573
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:36,000
called the fate and amazing stories you

574
00:23:41,690 --> 00:23:38,930
know what pulp magazines yeah scenes

575
00:23:44,150 --> 00:23:41,700
kind of they're kind of like comic books

576
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:44,160
before pictures gotcha

577
00:23:48,050 --> 00:23:45,930
I don't had science fiction stories and

578
00:23:50,780 --> 00:23:48,060
also as though one of the things that

579
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:50,790
this publisher Ray Palmer put in his

580
00:23:55,340 --> 00:23:52,890
though were stories about something

581
00:23:59,630 --> 00:23:55,350
called the shaver mystery and this was a

582
00:24:01,130 --> 00:23:59,640
a kind of a legend created by a a welder

583
00:24:03,950 --> 00:24:01,140
in Pennsylvania a guy named Richard

584
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:03,960
shaver who said he was picking up

585
00:24:07,460 --> 00:24:05,730
signals from his welding equipment and

586
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:07,470
learning all this things about this

587
00:24:13,490 --> 00:24:09,450
underground civilization called the

588
00:24:17,150 --> 00:24:13,500
Darrow's DEROS yeah for the detrimental

589
00:24:20,810 --> 00:24:17,160
robots and people and and Palmer

590
00:24:23,270 --> 00:24:20,820
published this stuff and people isn't

591
00:24:24,710 --> 00:24:23,280
his audience around the world started

592
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:24,720
writing stories saying yeah I've seen

593
00:24:27,180 --> 00:24:26,250
those creatures and the creatures really

594
00:24:29,670 --> 00:24:27,190
seem like the little gray

595
00:24:31,410 --> 00:24:29,680
aliens too that people talk about and

596
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:31,420
I've said you know and so he would

597
00:24:34,500 --> 00:24:33,010
publish this in the letters columns and

598
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:34,510
fredchristman was one of the letter

599
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:36,970
writers and he talked about encountering

600
00:24:41,700 --> 00:24:39,610
the day rows in Burma and getting some

601
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:41,710
kind of laser beam shot into his arm you

602
00:24:45,030 --> 00:24:42,850
know it was before the laser was

603
00:24:46,710 --> 00:24:45,040
invented yeah if you can describe a

604
00:24:49,170 --> 00:24:46,720
technology before it's even out there I

605
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:49,180
mean that gets incredibly well Chrisman

606
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:50,290
though Chrisman was on the scene even

607
00:24:54,270 --> 00:24:52,930
before that there was the first article

608
00:24:56,130 --> 00:24:54,280
ever on a science fiction convention

609
00:24:58,650 --> 00:24:56,140
appeared in a magazine called Harper's

610
00:25:00,180 --> 00:24:58,660
Weekly and fredchristman is interviewed

611
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:00,190
he's one of the people there he so

612
00:25:03,660 --> 00:25:01,450
science fiction guy and he's just

613
00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:03,670
telling about how how neat it is to be

614
00:25:09,260 --> 00:25:06,090
the science fiction convention weird

615
00:25:11,670 --> 00:25:09,270
yeah so it's like is he like a was he a

616
00:25:15,360 --> 00:25:11,680
conspiracy investigator or paranormal

617
00:25:21,030 --> 00:25:15,370
investigator turned CIA operative well

618
00:25:22,980 --> 00:25:21,040
he was a veteran he was in like a lot of

619
00:25:25,530 --> 00:25:22,990
people a lot of the guys in world war ii

620
00:25:30,180 --> 00:25:25,540
he fought in world war ii and in korea

621
00:25:36,380 --> 00:25:30,190
he was reactivated so he was an army guy

622
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:36,390
and a science fiction and also he was a

623
00:25:42,300 --> 00:25:39,610
worker at the Hanford nuclear reactor up

624
00:25:43,470 --> 00:25:42,310
there in the Pacific Northwest which

625
00:25:44,700 --> 00:25:43,480
gives us another interesting little

626
00:25:46,710 --> 00:25:44,710
piece of this history because the guy

627
00:25:49,590 --> 00:25:46,720
who proved approved his job application

628
00:25:52,770 --> 00:25:49,600
when he got that job is a guy named Mark

629
00:25:56,430 --> 00:25:52,780
felt mark felt is now known to history

630
00:26:00,030 --> 00:25:56,440
as the informant deep throat to Woodward

631
00:26:01,830 --> 00:26:00,040
and Bernstein of Watergate Fame hmm so

632
00:26:03,300 --> 00:26:01,840
you've got that connected up I mean and

633
00:26:07,190 --> 00:26:03,310
then the curious thing about that also

634
00:26:10,260 --> 00:26:07,200
is that mark felt was was a was a writer

635
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:10,270
for television shows - a consultant and

636
00:26:16,190 --> 00:26:11,650
a writer like a lot of intelligence

637
00:26:19,650 --> 00:26:16,200
people are and he wrote or consulted of

638
00:26:21,450 --> 00:26:19,660
to a program called the FBI which was a

639
00:26:23,310 --> 00:26:21,460
Quinn Martin production is named the

640
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:23,320
production company Quinn Martin also

641
00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:25,810
produced a program called the invaders

642
00:26:34,950 --> 00:26:29,530
with Roy Thinnes and Chrisman made the

643
00:26:38,010 --> 00:26:34,960
claim and in in 68 that this story of

644
00:26:42,300 --> 00:26:38,020
the invaders which was architect David

645
00:26:46,290 --> 00:26:42,310
Fitness sees actually a very

646
00:26:48,090 --> 00:26:46,300
well done a damn ski craft I know if you

647
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:48,100
know George Adamski if you know your UFO

648
00:26:53,010 --> 00:26:51,250
lore but he sees this craft one night

649
00:26:54,630 --> 00:26:53,020
it's a flying saucer and he sees the

650
00:26:55,950 --> 00:26:54,640
aliens and he knows the aliens are there

651
00:26:57,810 --> 00:26:55,960
and he's and the premise of the show is

652
00:27:00,090 --> 00:26:57,820
that he's out to fight the alien

653
00:27:02,700 --> 00:27:00,100
conspiracy and christen saying this is

654
00:27:04,890 --> 00:27:02,710
the story this is my story this is the

655
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:04,900
show is about me and you know people

656
00:27:11,910 --> 00:27:09,970
Chrisman gyri nuts crazy but but here is

657
00:27:14,580 --> 00:27:11,920
connected directly connected to mark

658
00:27:16,740 --> 00:27:14,590
felt because it's felt who got him a job

659
00:27:18,300 --> 00:27:16,750
at the Hanford nuclear reactor and it's

660
00:27:19,500 --> 00:27:18,310
felt as if consultants at the Quinn

661
00:27:23,460 --> 00:27:19,510
Martin Productions which makes the

662
00:27:26,340 --> 00:27:23,470
invaders so that make sense to me and

663
00:27:28,230 --> 00:27:26,350
definitely makes you think yeah so it's

664
00:27:29,790 --> 00:27:28,240
that it's not just a historic trail it's

665
00:27:32,790 --> 00:27:29,800
a whole architecture that holds up the

666
00:27:34,500 --> 00:27:32,800
premise and one thing I wanted to to

667
00:27:36,120 --> 00:27:34,510
address about the Maury island case is

668
00:27:37,650 --> 00:27:36,130
I've talked to a few friends you know

669
00:27:39,090 --> 00:27:37,660
just just [\h__\h] I'm like talking

670
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:39,100
about what's gonna come up on the show

671
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:41,410
and I mention it and I was met several

672
00:27:44,580 --> 00:27:42,850
times with the response I thought that I

673
00:27:46,340 --> 00:27:44,590
thought that was dismissed as a hoax so

674
00:27:48,930 --> 00:27:46,350
I feel like we should address that

675
00:27:50,730 --> 00:27:48,940
because you know you a lot of people

676
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:50,740
think it was a hoax you don't and I

677
00:28:02,190 --> 00:27:58,740
well you know when I when I was looking

678
00:28:04,170 --> 00:28:02,200
at is just that the man's light that

679
00:28:05,940 --> 00:28:04,180
will go into the men in black visitation

680
00:28:07,650 --> 00:28:05,950
okay so that's what I was hesitating

681
00:28:10,890 --> 00:28:07,660
because I had already given you so much

682
00:28:12,810 --> 00:28:10,900
lore a lot more but here we go yeah this

683
00:28:14,070 --> 00:28:12,820
is the the the idea that it was a hoax

684
00:28:15,930 --> 00:28:14,080
the reason people think it was a hoax or

685
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:15,940
one of the reasons outside of the fact

686
00:28:19,470 --> 00:28:17,890
that everything connected UFOs is a hoax

687
00:28:21,330 --> 00:28:19,480
you know people like to think of

688
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:21,340
themselves as critically intelligent

689
00:28:26,610 --> 00:28:23,290
people marketing you know take anything

690
00:28:30,540 --> 00:28:26,620
seriously it's all a hoax that Harold

691
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:30,550
Dahl the guy the victim of the mauryan

692
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:33,970
case said it was a hoax he originally

693
00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:35,170
came forward he was telling everybody

694
00:28:39,210 --> 00:28:37,450
what had happened and then all of a

695
00:28:41,070 --> 00:28:39,220
sudden one day yeah the men in black

696
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:41,080
show up and this is the beginning of the

697
00:28:44,820 --> 00:28:43,210
men in black phenomena and they could go

698
00:28:47,370 --> 00:28:44,830
to and they say you will stop talking

699
00:28:49,470 --> 00:28:47,380
about this or bad things will happen to

700
00:28:50,159 --> 00:28:49,480
you and he was like oh yeah that's a

701
00:28:52,380 --> 00:28:50,169
bunch

702
00:28:53,549 --> 00:28:52,390
and he kept on telling people many

703
00:28:58,049 --> 00:28:53,559
people is it good about what had

704
00:29:00,779 --> 00:28:58,059
happened to him and his his wife fell

705
00:29:01,500 --> 00:29:00,789
ill after that the son who had the

706
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:01,510
injured arm

707
00:29:06,269 --> 00:29:04,570
disappeared and it was gone for months

708
00:29:07,529 --> 00:29:06,279
and months and they found him he was

709
00:29:10,919 --> 00:29:07,539
like abducted or something and they

710
00:29:12,630 --> 00:29:10,929
found him in Wyoming somewhere without

711
00:29:14,310 --> 00:29:12,640
about memories of what had happened to

712
00:29:16,049 --> 00:29:14,320
him and that kind of thing and all this

713
00:29:17,820 --> 00:29:16,059
all those weird stuff started coming

714
00:29:21,289 --> 00:29:17,830
down and Harold also at that point he

715
00:29:23,899 --> 00:29:21,299
said okay I'm a believer it was a hoax

716
00:29:26,250 --> 00:29:23,909
if anybody asked me it's a hoax

717
00:29:28,529 --> 00:29:26,260
right if you can look at those things in

718
00:29:31,740 --> 00:29:28,539
his actual life and you know determine

719
00:29:36,029 --> 00:29:31,750
the downward spiral I see validity to

720
00:29:39,779 --> 00:29:36,039
that yeah thing about Harold Dahl is

721
00:29:42,060 --> 00:29:39,789
that they're the the three tramps in the

722
00:29:44,039 --> 00:29:42,070
rail yard have official arrest records

723
00:29:45,510 --> 00:29:44,049
there are official people that they say

724
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:45,520
it wasn't one of them as a guy named

725
00:29:55,620 --> 00:29:48,130
Harold Doyle which if you say with the

726
00:29:58,560 --> 00:29:55,630
Texas accent Harold Dahl that's just a

727
00:30:00,269 --> 00:29:58,570
coincidence right well you know you you

728
00:30:01,889 --> 00:30:00,279
have AB line in Para politics that I

729
00:30:03,299 --> 00:30:01,899
think is great and you say there's there

730
00:30:05,250 --> 00:30:03,309
are two schools of thought you're either

731
00:30:07,470 --> 00:30:05,260
a conspiracy theorist or a coincidence

732
00:30:09,659 --> 00:30:07,480
theorist no I think that's great I find

733
00:30:11,370 --> 00:30:09,669
that all the time and a big part of why

734
00:30:13,710 --> 00:30:11,380
I butt heads with some more conventional

735
00:30:15,330 --> 00:30:13,720
people is this issue of how much weight

736
00:30:17,159 --> 00:30:15,340
you put on coincidence that's really all

737
00:30:19,070 --> 00:30:17,169
we're talking about and even that can be

738
00:30:21,810 --> 00:30:19,080
a slippery slope though wouldn't you say

739
00:30:23,279 --> 00:30:21,820
yeah yeah yeah well I mean it's part of

740
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:23,289
you know I've been lecturing about Maury

741
00:30:26,970 --> 00:30:24,970
island and JFK for a couple of years now

742
00:30:29,010 --> 00:30:26,980
and part of the way I'm pushing the for

743
00:30:30,060 --> 00:30:29,020
this story forward and making my

744
00:30:32,519 --> 00:30:30,070
lectures a little bit different than

745
00:30:35,190 --> 00:30:32,529
they have been is examining this whole

746
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:35,200
idea of coincidence and synchronicity

747
00:30:40,769 --> 00:30:38,890
and what role it plays I bring with me

748
00:30:42,060 --> 00:30:40,779
now these episodes of route 66 I

749
00:30:44,580 --> 00:30:42,070
mentioned one but they're actually two

750
00:30:45,810 --> 00:30:44,590
well actually there are three right what

751
00:30:48,450 --> 00:30:45,820
else is interesting about that

752
00:30:50,250 --> 00:30:48,460
well the route 66 opens up in Fort Worth

753
00:30:53,460 --> 00:30:50,260
at the Fort Worth Airport where Kennedy

754
00:30:55,230 --> 00:30:53,470
flew in that day one of the guys again

755
00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:55,240
it's George Maharis the neal cassady

756
00:30:59,669 --> 00:30:57,250
figure gets a job at the trademart

757
00:31:00,899 --> 00:30:59,679
which is where Kennedy was going to

758
00:31:03,030 --> 00:31:00,909
before you got shot he was supposed to

759
00:31:05,250 --> 00:31:03,040
give a talk at the trademark and

760
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:05,260
in Dallas and then at some point one of

761
00:31:07,260 --> 00:31:06,370
the characters gets on the phone and

762
00:31:10,170 --> 00:31:07,270
starts talking to Earl

763
00:31:13,500 --> 00:31:10,180
Cabala who is the mayor of Dallas and

764
00:31:16,470 --> 00:31:13,510
it's his brother Charles who was a CIA

765
00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:16,480
operative who was fired by JFK for his

766
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:19,330
role in the Bay of Pigs and it's earl

767
00:31:22,980 --> 00:31:21,250
cabal who changes the motorcade route

768
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:22,990
from where it was supposed to be going

769
00:31:27,420 --> 00:31:24,490
to the road in front of the Book

770
00:31:30,690 --> 00:31:27,430
Depository and the grassy knoll and so

771
00:31:32,730 --> 00:31:30,700
all of this is written into the script

772
00:31:36,570 --> 00:31:32,740
of this route 66 episode which was

773
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:36,580
broadcast in 1962 a year before the

774
00:31:41,910 --> 00:31:39,850
assassination it'll make your jaw drop I

775
00:31:45,450 --> 00:31:41,920
mean you know we talked about route 66

776
00:31:46,770 --> 00:31:45,460
the invasion I mean that's one area that

777
00:31:49,340 --> 00:31:46,780
I'm really interested in is that

778
00:31:52,970 --> 00:31:49,350
crossover between Hollywood and

779
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:52,980
conspiracy or Hollywood in real events

780
00:31:57,630 --> 00:31:55,930
what would your explanation for that be

781
00:32:00,960 --> 00:31:57,640
like have you come to any conclusions

782
00:32:02,100 --> 00:32:00,970
regarding why that takes place well it

783
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:02,110
could be any number of things you know

784
00:32:05,790 --> 00:32:03,730
there are people that really get into

785
00:32:08,070 --> 00:32:05,800
these kind of mystical connections of

786
00:32:09,630 --> 00:32:08,080
coincidences and synchronicity my old

787
00:32:12,690 --> 00:32:09,640
friend Robert Anton Wilson wrote the

788
00:32:16,140 --> 00:32:12,700
book illuminatus made great use of that

789
00:32:19,470 --> 00:32:16,150
in his another writer James Shelby

790
00:32:20,910 --> 00:32:19,480
Donner is well known for connecting up

791
00:32:22,980 --> 00:32:20,920
all these coincidental notes that

792
00:32:24,750 --> 00:32:22,990
connects it connects the assassination

793
00:32:26,790 --> 00:32:24,760
to masonry and all that stuff so there's

794
00:32:31,710 --> 00:32:26,800
that gilmore but there's also this idea

795
00:32:33,570 --> 00:32:31,720
that and john judge tried to make this

796
00:32:38,190 --> 00:32:33,580
clear to me john judge runs the

797
00:32:42,090 --> 00:32:38,200
committee for a committee on political

798
00:32:44,220 --> 00:32:42,100
assassinations the big JFK RFK MLK

799
00:32:45,780 --> 00:32:44,230
activist group run out of Washington DC

800
00:32:48,300 --> 00:32:45,790
the people that are going to be putting

801
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:48,310
on the big protest there this year in

802
00:32:54,060 --> 00:32:52,690
Dallas and John judge was a student and

803
00:32:56,190 --> 00:32:54,070
a close friend of mayor Brussels and

804
00:32:59,340 --> 00:32:56,200
he's like one of the stalwarts of

805
00:33:01,980 --> 00:32:59,350
conspiracy research and his view of it

806
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:01,990
is that these intelligence agencies in

807
00:33:05,850 --> 00:33:04,450
the intelligence agents are we got them

808
00:33:08,430 --> 00:33:05,860
throughout the entertainment industry

809
00:33:10,020 --> 00:33:08,440
and they try out things you know they

810
00:33:11,790 --> 00:33:10,030
come up with an idea that maybe they can

811
00:33:14,850 --> 00:33:11,800
pull off and they put it in a script to

812
00:33:16,899 --> 00:33:14,860
see how it works out and so you can see

813
00:33:20,110 --> 00:33:16,909
time and again

814
00:33:22,299 --> 00:33:20,120
things that happen are like kind of

815
00:33:24,940 --> 00:33:22,309
predicted in the media I ran into this

816
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:24,950
one I did you know I yeah I'm kind of

817
00:33:27,820 --> 00:33:26,450
known for this book called the octopus

818
00:33:32,740 --> 00:33:27,830
which is based on the Danny casolaro

819
00:33:35,580 --> 00:33:32,750
case which involved this the software

820
00:33:38,740 --> 00:33:35,590
called the promis software that was a

821
00:33:42,370 --> 00:33:38,750
Shanghai and using something called the

822
00:33:45,399 --> 00:33:42,380
install scandal but that idea was put

823
00:33:47,110 --> 00:33:45,409
into an episode of the lone gunman which

824
00:33:50,769 --> 00:33:47,120
was this you remember the lone gunman

825
00:33:52,779 --> 00:33:50,779
was like a x-files offshoot show gotcha

826
00:33:55,509 --> 00:33:52,789
yeah there were three three guys who

827
00:33:57,549 --> 00:33:55,519
published a zine and they were there

828
00:33:59,200 --> 00:33:57,559
first thing they investigated was the

829
00:34:01,240 --> 00:33:59,210
software that was being put into a plane

830
00:34:03,820 --> 00:34:01,250
that was being set up to crash into the

831
00:34:06,220 --> 00:34:03,830
World Trade Towers and this was months

832
00:34:07,659 --> 00:34:06,230
before the trade sour thing yeah just oh

833
00:34:09,909 --> 00:34:07,669
that was months before

834
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:09,919
yeah just months before why Sam yeah it

835
00:34:14,710 --> 00:34:12,770
was a ghost March of 2001 it is crazy I

836
00:34:16,300 --> 00:34:14,720
mean even you know more recent times you

837
00:34:18,970 --> 00:34:16,310
see it in the Batman movie in the Dark

838
00:34:21,089 --> 00:34:18,980
Knight movie we're shooting right that's

839
00:34:22,930 --> 00:34:21,099
it well that's what's happening with

840
00:34:24,250 --> 00:34:22,940
Sandy Hook you know they could be

841
00:34:26,710 --> 00:34:24,260
killings in Sandy Hook you go to this

842
00:34:29,770 --> 00:34:26,720
Batman movie there's a scene in the

843
00:34:32,050 --> 00:34:29,780
Batman movies a mat next to a a a cell

844
00:34:35,530 --> 00:34:32,060
phone and the map says Sandy Hook yes

845
00:34:37,569 --> 00:34:35,540
you know it's you got this and there's a

846
00:34:41,379 --> 00:34:37,579
there's a developing line of research

847
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:41,389
that all of us had to do with a banking

848
00:34:46,059 --> 00:34:43,490
scandal called LIBOR Li Bo lar

849
00:34:49,089 --> 00:34:46,069
yeah yeah yeah and the hearings for that

850
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:49,099
were called off after San Diego and that

851
00:34:57,520 --> 00:34:54,490
the parents of the killer in Aurora and

852
00:34:59,440 --> 00:34:57,530
some of the kids in in Sandy Hook that

853
00:35:01,059 --> 00:34:59,450
both of them were somehow connected to

854
00:35:02,349 --> 00:35:01,069
this LIBOR scandal and that what's

855
00:35:04,990 --> 00:35:02,359
really going on is a big cover-up of

856
00:35:07,720 --> 00:35:05,000
that right that's kind of what I was

857
00:35:08,950 --> 00:35:07,730
gonna ask you is if what you thought the

858
00:35:10,270 --> 00:35:08,960
motivations were for that because

859
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:10,280
there's there's people who say it's a

860
00:35:13,660 --> 00:35:12,050
false flag to usher in stricter gun

861
00:35:16,390 --> 00:35:13,670
control there's people who says an

862
00:35:18,089 --> 00:35:16,400
Illuminati ritual killing and then right

863
00:35:20,770 --> 00:35:18,099
there's that that LIBOR scandal

864
00:35:23,260 --> 00:35:20,780
situation where both John Holmes and

865
00:35:25,180 --> 00:35:23,270
Adam Lanza's fathers were apparently set

866
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:25,190
to testify and that's just what I read

867
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:26,810
on the Internet like what do you make of

868
00:35:29,770 --> 00:35:28,130
all that because I don't see if it was a

869
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:29,780
if there it set the test

870
00:35:33,970 --> 00:35:31,850
to find the LIBOR scandal I guess it

871
00:35:35,890 --> 00:35:33,980
could be like a punishment for them like

872
00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:35,900
hey we're gonna make your kid we're

873
00:35:40,240 --> 00:35:37,610
gonna mind control your kid into being a

874
00:35:42,310 --> 00:35:40,250
patsy for this brutal massacre and

875
00:35:44,290 --> 00:35:42,320
that's all fine and good but what about

876
00:35:45,850 --> 00:35:44,300
the people that when you just kill that

877
00:35:48,790 --> 00:35:45,860
kid wouldn't you just kill his kid and

878
00:35:51,820 --> 00:35:48,800
say you know now testify well the idea

879
00:35:54,850 --> 00:35:51,830
was to create these these situations

880
00:35:58,390 --> 00:35:54,860
that become more important than any kind

881
00:36:00,670 --> 00:35:58,400
of investigation of some obscure banking

882
00:36:03,490 --> 00:36:00,680
scandal in England at that point a

883
00:36:04,570 --> 00:36:03,500
sexier story right so I mean so all that

884
00:36:06,010 --> 00:36:04,580
stuff just gets dropped because

885
00:36:07,090 --> 00:36:06,020
everybody else is paying attention to it

886
00:36:09,550 --> 00:36:07,100
that's why I think the one thing that

887
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:09,560
it's not about is a sec Amendment

888
00:36:14,050 --> 00:36:12,530
argument or you know gun control right

889
00:36:15,490 --> 00:36:14,060
right this is just too much attention

890
00:36:17,740 --> 00:36:15,500
being paid of it that's got to be the

891
00:36:19,240 --> 00:36:17,750
false dialog minute people want us to

892
00:36:20,770 --> 00:36:19,250
pay attention to to cover up something

893
00:36:22,090 --> 00:36:20,780
else right it seemed to me to be more

894
00:36:24,370 --> 00:36:22,100
likely than it's that it's something

895
00:36:26,410 --> 00:36:24,380
like this that's a great point you

896
00:36:28,300 --> 00:36:26,420
mentioned wilhelm reich earlier and

897
00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:28,310
something i wanted to get to is another

898
00:36:33,190 --> 00:36:30,770
story in that popular pair of politics

899
00:36:35,260 --> 00:36:33,200
great book it was very odd was the

900
00:36:40,420 --> 00:36:35,270
cloudbuster canon can you tell us about

901
00:36:44,470 --> 00:36:40,430
the cloudbuster canon oh where to begin

902
00:36:48,340 --> 00:36:44,480
well wilhelm reich was a protege of

903
00:36:51,220 --> 00:36:48,350
Sigmund Freud during the early days of

904
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:51,230
development of psychoanalysis and he

905
00:36:56,110 --> 00:36:53,930
came up with his own theories about

906
00:36:57,700 --> 00:36:56,120
character structure that are still very

907
00:36:59,710 --> 00:36:57,710
important texts and people you know go

908
00:37:01,360 --> 00:36:59,720
into psychology or psychiatry they're

909
00:37:03,330 --> 00:37:01,370
they're always still required to read

910
00:37:07,570 --> 00:37:03,340
character analysis but it was I'm right

911
00:37:10,060 --> 00:37:07,580
but when he his first exiled to Norway

912
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:10,070
where he he started doing experiments

913
00:37:17,740 --> 00:37:14,450
that tried to establish the underlying

914
00:37:19,630 --> 00:37:17,750
energy force in life those are the bayan

915
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:19,640
experiments he left Norway came to

916
00:37:24,610 --> 00:37:23,210
America and the at that point his

917
00:37:27,250 --> 00:37:24,620
research developed and he started

918
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:27,260
calling this energy Oregon and he

919
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:28,970
started creating a technology on how to

920
00:37:32,470 --> 00:37:30,410
develop it now to use it there were

921
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:32,480
Oregon boxes and the idea was that

922
00:37:36,820 --> 00:37:34,370
people could sit in the Oregon box and

923
00:37:40,990 --> 00:37:36,830
charge up their life energy and come out

924
00:37:43,870 --> 00:37:41,000
of it much healthier more vibrant kind

925
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:43,880
of thing and then as that technology

926
00:37:49,240 --> 00:37:46,850
developed he created the cloud buster

927
00:37:50,980 --> 00:37:49,250
gonna call Buster cannon which was

928
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:50,990
supposed to operate on the environment

929
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:52,850
the way it operated on people the

930
00:37:58,480 --> 00:37:54,650
purpose of the cloud Buster was to

931
00:38:00,850 --> 00:37:58,490
slowly gradually increase moisture in

932
00:38:05,890 --> 00:38:00,860
desert regions to fruit to find the

933
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:05,900
earth to make it less of a wasteland but

934
00:38:12,580 --> 00:38:09,610
what happened and I just covered Oh

935
00:38:17,530 --> 00:38:12,590
Mike's whole life there's three times

936
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:17,540
good so I urge everybody to not listen

937
00:38:22,210 --> 00:38:19,370
to me but just take me as a cue to go

938
00:38:24,370 --> 00:38:22,220
green ripe for one thing whether ripe

939
00:38:26,380 --> 00:38:24,380
was was was wrong or nuts or whatever

940
00:38:27,790 --> 00:38:26,390
read him he's brilliant one way or

941
00:38:29,740 --> 00:38:27,800
another just read him if you want to

942
00:38:32,170 --> 00:38:29,750
understand the psychology well what

943
00:38:36,900 --> 00:38:32,180
happened there at the end was that he

944
00:38:39,310 --> 00:38:36,910
created these what when he created these

945
00:38:41,140 --> 00:38:39,320
weapons he brought them out to the

946
00:38:43,510 --> 00:38:41,150
desert and one interesting fact is that

947
00:38:46,390 --> 00:38:43,520
in his last book contact with space he

948
00:38:46,840 --> 00:38:46,400
talks about going through Roswell New

949
00:38:49,270 --> 00:38:46,850
Mexico

950
00:38:51,460 --> 00:38:49,280
this is 1955 it's actually an argument I

951
00:38:54,090 --> 00:38:51,470
have with a lot of ufologists and a lot

952
00:38:56,140 --> 00:38:54,100
of skeptics who believe that the Roswell

953
00:38:58,570 --> 00:38:56,150
was a product that you know that

954
00:39:01,180 --> 00:38:58,580
something happened in 47 but the people

955
00:39:02,950 --> 00:39:01,190
thought about it and then in 1980 Stan

956
00:39:04,750 --> 00:39:02,960
treatment all these guys saw an

957
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:04,760
opportunity to exploit it and bring it

958
00:39:09,340 --> 00:39:06,410
back well this is not true because

959
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:09,350
Roswell had a long impact that's

960
00:39:14,140 --> 00:39:12,170
measurable in history long before 1980

961
00:39:17,980 --> 00:39:14,150
long before you know the resurgence of

962
00:39:20,620 --> 00:39:17,990
interest at that point in 1955 wilhelm

963
00:39:22,900 --> 00:39:20,630
reich takes his cloudbuster guns through

964
00:39:25,240 --> 00:39:22,910
roswell new mexico talks about the alien

965
00:39:26,410 --> 00:39:25,250
environment the dry environment starts

966
00:39:27,910 --> 00:39:26,420
coming up with his idea that this is

967
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:27,920
what the aliens are doing if they're

968
00:39:32,350 --> 00:39:29,330
sucking the living energy out of the

969
00:39:34,090 --> 00:39:32,360
earth their own sake and it's not a big

970
00:39:35,620 --> 00:39:34,100
part of contact with space but it's

971
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:35,630
clear and it's clear from other passages

972
00:39:39,460 --> 00:39:37,850
that he heard the radio reports about

973
00:39:41,470 --> 00:39:39,470
Roswell and it's clear that he's going

974
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:41,480
out to see what kind of impact whatever

975
00:39:47,470 --> 00:39:44,690
this alien connection is is having on

976
00:39:49,780 --> 00:39:47,480
the earth and so in the process of doing

977
00:39:54,130 --> 00:39:49,790
that he starts well actually even before

978
00:39:56,050 --> 00:39:54,140
that and in Maine he started seeing UFOs

979
00:39:57,580 --> 00:39:56,060
himself flying saucers himself and he

980
00:40:02,440 --> 00:39:57,590
started pointing the Papa

981
00:40:04,780 --> 00:40:02,450
at them and they start to blink out so

982
00:40:07,240 --> 00:40:04,790
so you got the idea that you know that

983
00:40:11,050 --> 00:40:07,250
maybe you know I mean see radically to

984
00:40:13,930 --> 00:40:11,060
him that maybe redirecting Oregon stream

985
00:40:17,770 --> 00:40:13,940
toward these UFO would be one way to

986
00:40:19,570 --> 00:40:17,780
battle them yeah that's what I read and

987
00:40:22,030 --> 00:40:19,580
I was like that is so interesting

988
00:40:23,940 --> 00:40:22,040
because I mean it must mean that he was

989
00:40:26,980 --> 00:40:23,950
seeing them fairly frequently

990
00:40:30,370 --> 00:40:26,990
yeah and across the country I'll tell

991
00:40:33,250 --> 00:40:30,380
you what another another pop culture a

992
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:33,260
pair of political dimension to this is a

993
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:33,890
movie called

994
00:40:38,980 --> 00:40:35,690
earth vs. flying saucers you ever see

995
00:40:40,630 --> 00:40:38,990
that one I have seen that it is pretty

996
00:40:43,210 --> 00:40:40,640
it's pretty low budget if I remember

997
00:40:45,070 --> 00:40:43,220
yeah yeah well it has special effects by

998
00:40:47,020 --> 00:40:45,080
Ray Harryhausen who's like famous for

999
00:40:47,230 --> 00:40:47,030
being one of the great so black and

1000
00:40:52,660 --> 00:40:47,240
white

1001
00:40:54,580 --> 00:40:52,670
in the 50s the load up these cloudbuster

1002
00:40:56,590 --> 00:40:54,590
guns on the backs of jeeps and fight

1003
00:40:58,420 --> 00:40:56,600
flying saucers in that movie and they

1004
00:40:59,740 --> 00:40:58,430
finally they capture one of the aliens

1005
00:41:02,590 --> 00:40:59,750
and he the aliens would walk around

1006
00:41:04,540 --> 00:41:02,600
these big helmets on they remove his

1007
00:41:07,500 --> 00:41:04,550
helmet and it's a it's a it's a roswell

1008
00:41:10,870 --> 00:41:07,510
gray you know so there's more proof that

1009
00:41:13,830 --> 00:41:10,880
you know roswell was not off of people's

1010
00:41:15,700 --> 00:41:13,840
minds it was you know i mean that was a

1011
00:41:19,540 --> 00:41:15,710
it was a movie there's getting wine

1012
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:19,550
distribution and roswell in there and

1013
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:22,570
you have Reich's cloudbuster guns or

1014
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:25,490
yeah i can't imagine that story would

1015
00:41:29,020 --> 00:41:27,050
have been forgotten ten years later i

1016
00:41:30,910 --> 00:41:29,030
mean look at 9/11 people are still

1017
00:41:32,500 --> 00:41:30,920
debating that you know it doesn't seem

1018
00:41:34,840 --> 00:41:32,510
like it was even ten years ago but a

1019
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:34,850
story like that the first UFO crash the

1020
00:41:40,090 --> 00:41:37,490
first alien bodies recovered i mean a

1021
00:41:45,850 --> 00:41:40,100
story like that that's not gonna get to

1022
00:41:47,110 --> 00:41:45,860
page five and ten years yeah it's almost

1023
00:41:49,060 --> 00:41:47,120
every time you turn around I mean I

1024
00:41:52,390 --> 00:41:49,070
found references I found Roswell Gray's

1025
00:41:56,590 --> 00:41:52,400
in a Japanese cartoon called prints

1026
00:41:59,380 --> 00:41:56,600
planet from 1965 you know things like

1027
00:42:01,090 --> 00:41:59,390
that you know well you know we're

1028
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:01,100
talking about aliens let's you've been

1029
00:42:04,450 --> 00:42:02,570
involved in this for a long time you've

1030
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:04,460
been writing for a long time longer than

1031
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:07,010
I've been breathing and have you hold

1032
00:42:10,300 --> 00:42:07,970
out

1033
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:10,310
well you know it's a good a good thing

1034
00:42:15,970 --> 00:42:12,890
in this case but have you ever tried to

1035
00:42:17,650 --> 00:42:15,980
map out a timeline of alien human

1036
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:17,660
contact like what does that look like to

1037
00:42:20,890 --> 00:42:18,890
you do you do you think that they're

1038
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:20,900
just visitors who you know even our own

1039
00:42:25,060 --> 00:42:22,370
governments don't know what's going on

1040
00:42:27,010 --> 00:42:25,070
or are they in contact I mean I've heard

1041
00:42:29,650 --> 00:42:27,020
the Eisenhower story probably the most

1042
00:42:31,810 --> 00:42:29,660
fascinating story right yeah do you

1043
00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:31,820
think any like what's your what's your

1044
00:42:38,340 --> 00:42:33,770
timeline for alien human contact have

1045
00:42:40,690 --> 00:42:38,350
you if you had to bet when it started uh

1046
00:42:42,460 --> 00:42:40,700
well I mean of course you got the alien

1047
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:42,470
ancient aliens idea you've got the

1048
00:42:45,580 --> 00:42:44,210
reptilian idea I mean that that's a

1049
00:42:50,470 --> 00:42:45,590
possibility could have started forever

1050
00:42:53,470 --> 00:42:50,480
ago let me answer it this way is not a

1051
00:42:56,790 --> 00:42:53,480
non mainstream theory that aliens have

1052
00:42:59,170 --> 00:42:56,800
visited this planet and have been

1053
00:43:01,300 --> 00:42:59,180
manipulating it and changing it this is

1054
00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:01,310
a theory that was put forward by Francis

1055
00:43:09,340 --> 00:43:01,610
Crick

1056
00:43:11,590 --> 00:43:09,350
discovered DNA Kirk's idea was directed

1057
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:11,600
panspermia that life itself on this

1058
00:43:15,580 --> 00:43:13,370
planet was brought here by aliens

1059
00:43:18,010 --> 00:43:15,590
you know and I don't know if they're

1060
00:43:21,940 --> 00:43:18,020
reptiles or bug-eyed aliens or whatever

1061
00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:21,950
but it's not a non common sense view it

1062
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:23,810
is a mainstream point of view

1063
00:43:27,190 --> 00:43:25,130
so they're actually something like that

1064
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:27,200
they're beginning to realize more and

1065
00:43:32,140 --> 00:43:28,970
more that you know because because I

1066
00:43:35,740 --> 00:43:32,150
work underground mostly in in a

1067
00:43:38,380 --> 00:43:35,750
counterculture I assume that that most

1068
00:43:40,930 --> 00:43:38,390
of what I believe is kind of unique to

1069
00:43:42,850 --> 00:43:40,940
people believe but it's not you know

1070
00:43:45,940 --> 00:43:42,860
like I said the Kennedy assassination

1071
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:45,950
most people 99% of the people understand

1072
00:43:51,990 --> 00:43:48,290
that that was a conspiracy and the

1073
00:43:54,850 --> 00:43:52,000
government itself believes that aliens

1074
00:43:57,580 --> 00:43:54,860
manipulating human genetics and

1075
00:44:00,280 --> 00:43:57,590
interacting with earth people

1076
00:44:02,770 --> 00:44:00,290
that's Francis Crick it's mainstream

1077
00:44:05,050 --> 00:44:02,780
science yeah what an interesting

1078
00:44:07,210 --> 00:44:05,060
conclusion for him of all people to come

1079
00:44:11,620 --> 00:44:07,220
to strange the guy who understands life

1080
00:44:14,130 --> 00:44:11,630
that I've been so it's you know so I

1081
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:14,140
offered that out to everybody who

1082
00:44:19,300 --> 00:44:16,610
probably like yourself certainly like me

1083
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:19,310
who gets derided as a conspiracy nuts

1084
00:44:24,490 --> 00:44:20,810
and

1085
00:44:27,130 --> 00:44:24,500
you know Flying Saucer wacko but it's

1086
00:44:29,350 --> 00:44:27,140
not whacko you know we are normal people

1087
00:44:31,720 --> 00:44:29,360
and this is normal mainstream science

1088
00:44:34,150 --> 00:44:31,730
and also normal mainstream not politics

1089
00:44:36,220 --> 00:44:34,160
but para politics you know all right

1090
00:44:38,410 --> 00:44:36,230
and I have heard you talk about that

1091
00:44:40,030 --> 00:44:38,420
eisenhower story it's it's it's very

1092
00:44:43,630 --> 00:44:40,040
interesting it's the only story I know

1093
00:44:44,790 --> 00:44:43,640
of of a president communicating there

1094
00:44:47,350 --> 00:44:44,800
meeting with some type of

1095
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:47,360
extraterrestrial race do you know

1096
00:44:52,830 --> 00:44:49,010
there's also a right connection there

1097
00:44:55,060 --> 00:44:52,840
there's a diary entry that see that

1098
00:44:57,660 --> 00:44:55,070
actually if you look at eyes and how his

1099
00:44:59,950 --> 00:44:57,670
schedule he goes to Rangeley main

1100
00:45:01,990 --> 00:44:59,960
shortly after that alien incident and

1101
00:45:04,330 --> 00:45:02,000
it's pretty clear that he had some kind

1102
00:45:05,410 --> 00:45:04,340
of meeting with one right and and

1103
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:05,420
there's there's you know there's other

1104
00:45:09,340 --> 00:45:07,490
documentation there was there's

1105
00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:09,350
something called the color twining memo

1106
00:45:12,700 --> 00:45:11,090
that's in the National Archives I've

1107
00:45:14,530 --> 00:45:12,710
held this document my hand and it says

1108
00:45:17,650 --> 00:45:14,540
that they're they're rescheduling a

1109
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:17,660
special Studies subcommittee of mj-12

1110
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:20,210
in NJ 12 the mj-12 papers that's another

1111
00:45:29,140 --> 00:45:24,650
big part of the UFO war right but there

1112
00:45:30,940 --> 00:45:29,150
was another researcher of the biography

1113
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:30,950
of a british diplomat named do douglas

1114
00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:34,490
who came up with another document that

1115
00:45:42,430 --> 00:45:40,370
talks about reich getting a meeting with

1116
00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:42,440
people in the government on that precise

1117
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:44,090
day of the color twining memo so it's

1118
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:45,650
not just two pieces of documentation

1119
00:45:51,220 --> 00:45:48,050
it's like triangulation of research you

1120
00:45:52,750 --> 00:45:51,230
know yeah yeah so there's a clear

1121
00:45:54,340 --> 00:45:52,760
indication that the government had an

1122
00:45:57,460 --> 00:45:54,350
interest and they had an interest in

1123
00:46:00,430 --> 00:45:57,470
reich and you know as nutty as it all

1124
00:46:02,740 --> 00:46:00,440
seems it was something that was truly

1125
00:46:05,950 --> 00:46:02,750
going on yeah it seems to me like at

1126
00:46:07,150 --> 00:46:05,960
that time from probably 47 on it seemed

1127
00:46:09,190 --> 00:46:07,160
kind of like the government was

1128
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:09,200
scrambling they at one point they're

1129
00:46:12,100 --> 00:46:11,090
trying to suppress all this information

1130
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:12,110
at the same time they're trying to

1131
00:46:17,110 --> 00:46:14,330
gather their own information from people

1132
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:17,120
like reich or you know whoever doesn't

1133
00:46:22,510 --> 00:46:20,330
think that this is completely ludicrous

1134
00:46:23,770 --> 00:46:22,520
it's it's likely yeah they're trying to

1135
00:46:25,420 --> 00:46:23,780
put a lid on it you know they're trying

1136
00:46:27,700 --> 00:46:25,430
they're trying to own all the

1137
00:46:29,410 --> 00:46:27,710
information and and stay on top of it

1138
00:46:31,150 --> 00:46:29,420
what more do you know about the

1139
00:46:33,100 --> 00:46:31,160
eisenhower story it's really interesting

1140
00:46:34,630 --> 00:46:33,110
to me but it also seems really hard to

1141
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:34,640
believe because if there's a nail

1142
00:46:39,490 --> 00:46:37,010
in race you know coming to this planet

1143
00:46:42,339 --> 00:46:39,500
how do they get in contact with the

1144
00:46:44,980 --> 00:46:42,349
president without having a mass sighting

1145
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:44,990
without a mass disclosure like how do

1146
00:46:51,460 --> 00:46:46,970
you get in there that deep do you know

1147
00:46:52,750 --> 00:46:51,470
the the answer to that well what's the

1148
00:46:55,059 --> 00:46:52,760
best way to answer that I can tell you

1149
00:46:56,950 --> 00:46:55,069
one thing that the full story as I

1150
00:46:59,890 --> 00:46:56,960
understand it with as much documentation

1151
00:47:03,849 --> 00:46:59,900
as I can bring to it appears in secret

1152
00:47:08,250 --> 00:47:03,859
and suppressed to Eisenhower and aliens

1153
00:47:13,210 --> 00:47:08,260
and it's like anything else I mean not

1154
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:13,220
secrecy is been practiced particularly

1155
00:47:17,650 --> 00:47:14,690
the national security state you know

1156
00:47:19,809 --> 00:47:17,660
I've been practiced and done well for

1157
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:19,819
many years and develop so it doesn't it

1158
00:47:23,529 --> 00:47:21,410
doesn't seem so unusual that that you

1159
00:47:25,359 --> 00:47:23,539
know well I guess I mean it's it's

1160
00:47:27,250 --> 00:47:25,369
unusual in this way like think about us

1161
00:47:29,170 --> 00:47:27,260
think about if Mars was a civilization

1162
00:47:31,269 --> 00:47:29,180
you know that that didn't that couldn't

1163
00:47:34,589 --> 00:47:31,279
reach us and we wanted to go and make

1164
00:47:37,210 --> 00:47:34,599
contact with them how would we

1165
00:47:39,670 --> 00:47:37,220
infiltrate their system in a way that we

1166
00:47:41,249 --> 00:47:39,680
meet covertly with them one specific man

1167
00:47:44,620 --> 00:47:41,259
who actually is in charge of things

1168
00:47:46,269 --> 00:47:44,630
without just hopping down on the planet

1169
00:47:47,529 --> 00:47:46,279
and being like hey you know you know

1170
00:47:49,720 --> 00:47:47,539
here we are let's talk to some people

1171
00:47:51,519 --> 00:47:49,730
does that make sense like how would you

1172
00:47:53,079 --> 00:47:51,529
infiltrate their network when you don't

1173
00:47:54,849 --> 00:47:53,089
you don't speak the language you don't

1174
00:47:56,380 --> 00:47:54,859
you don't know how the government

1175
00:47:58,569 --> 00:47:56,390
operates you might not even know what a

1176
00:48:00,789 --> 00:47:58,579
government is it seems odd that they

1177
00:48:03,130 --> 00:48:00,799
they could streamline that communication

1178
00:48:05,019 --> 00:48:03,140
and keep it quiet well you might not but

1179
00:48:08,549 --> 00:48:05,029
then again your mind you know I mean if

1180
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:08,559
the aliens are intelligent and the idea

1181
00:48:14,380 --> 00:48:10,970
one of the big theories about Roswell is

1182
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:14,390
that they can became attracted to the

1183
00:48:20,349 --> 00:48:16,490
earth after the atomic explosions on the

1184
00:48:22,150 --> 00:48:20,359
desert so you know so they're monitoring

1185
00:48:23,799 --> 00:48:22,160
what's happening you idea that they are

1186
00:48:25,240 --> 00:48:23,809
monitoring communication that they can

1187
00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:25,250
figure out the bureaucracy actually

1188
00:48:28,660 --> 00:48:26,930
human bureaucracies are really kind of

1189
00:48:31,089 --> 00:48:28,670
easy to figure out who's the boss and

1190
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:31,099
listen you know and then if you sending

1191
00:48:36,759 --> 00:48:33,890
out people that you know men of black

1192
00:48:39,309 --> 00:48:36,769
sorts you know to interact and make

1193
00:48:40,930 --> 00:48:39,319
connections that way it makes a certain

1194
00:48:42,999 --> 00:48:40,940
amount of sense you know that kind of

1195
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:43,009
description of the alien activity does

1196
00:48:47,620 --> 00:48:44,450
seem to be something out of the 50s

1197
00:48:50,230 --> 00:48:47,630
though you know I

1198
00:48:53,170 --> 00:48:50,240
close encounter view is that it's all

1199
00:48:56,770 --> 00:48:53,180
gonna have to be pretty obvious yeah

1200
00:48:59,680 --> 00:48:56,780
right yeah that's true yeah I don't know

1201
00:49:00,970 --> 00:48:59,690
it's it's an odd thing yeah if you want

1202
00:49:04,180 --> 00:49:00,980
we can do we can do a whole program on

1203
00:49:06,010 --> 00:49:04,190
that one well that's what thing I want I

1204
00:49:07,390 --> 00:49:06,020
wanted to but I was wondering if there's

1205
00:49:11,470 --> 00:49:07,400
enough meat on those bones

1206
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:11,480
oh there's plenty has to do again with

1207
00:49:17,710 --> 00:49:13,130
going back to the biography of Wilhelm

1208
00:49:19,270 --> 00:49:17,720
Reich Reich was you know people said he

1209
00:49:21,130 --> 00:49:19,280
was crazy and he died had died in prison

1210
00:49:23,050 --> 00:49:21,140
because you know up until the time he

1211
00:49:28,810 --> 00:49:23,060
died he felt that Eisenhower was on his

1212
00:49:30,010 --> 00:49:28,820
side yeah that's gonna kind of sad you

1213
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:30,020
know what I'll tell you interesting Lee

1214
00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:34,010
enough just in terms of word rhyming

1215
00:49:39,850 --> 00:49:37,370
a guy who's into Reich is Ike David Icke

1216
00:49:42,100 --> 00:49:39,860
I think it's book called the biggest

1217
00:49:43,510 --> 00:49:42,110
secret reprints it puts a few pages of

1218
00:49:46,510 --> 00:49:43,520
contact with space which is Wilhelm

1219
00:49:49,180 --> 00:49:46,520
Reich famous last book very cool

1220
00:49:51,550 --> 00:49:49,190
yeah and and you know Reich our Ike

1221
00:49:53,350 --> 00:49:51,560
actually is also somebody who's really

1222
00:49:54,670 --> 00:49:53,360
kind of cute into coincidences that's

1223
00:49:58,090 --> 00:49:54,680
how he kind of started his career he

1224
00:50:00,130 --> 00:49:58,100
used to be a BBC sports writer yeah yeah

1225
00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:00,140
and then he it's some weird set of

1226
00:50:03,220 --> 00:50:01,370
coincidences and synchronicities

1227
00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:03,230
happened to him and he got onto this

1228
00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:05,450
path that he's on to now so it's part of

1229
00:50:11,110 --> 00:50:08,890
you know when I when I bring up the

1230
00:50:13,540 --> 00:50:11,120
Kennedy coincidences and the coincidence

1231
00:50:15,210 --> 00:50:13,550
between that and the Mauryan case I

1232
00:50:18,340 --> 00:50:15,220
mentioned also that David I could see

1233
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:18,350
some interest in that also Bob Dylan in

1234
00:50:21,700 --> 00:50:20,450
the last interview that he gave for

1235
00:50:23,170 --> 00:50:21,710
Rolling Stone he starts talking about as

1236
00:50:26,980 --> 00:50:23,180
a famous incident in rock history where

1237
00:50:29,110 --> 00:50:26,990
Dylan got into a motorcycle crash and it

1238
00:50:32,050 --> 00:50:29,120
was off the scene like in 1966 he was

1239
00:50:36,010 --> 00:50:32,060
also seen for many years but there was a

1240
00:50:38,110 --> 00:50:36,020
second Robert Zimmerman who died in a

1241
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:38,120
motorcycle crash at the same time Dylan

1242
00:50:40,990 --> 00:50:39,410
goes off about this and liberal

1243
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:41,000
extolling so it's talking about how it

1244
00:50:44,980 --> 00:50:42,410
transfigured again if it was something

1245
00:50:47,230 --> 00:50:44,990
about the amalgam of the coincidences of

1246
00:50:49,960 --> 00:50:47,240
those situations that kind of freaked

1247
00:50:53,500 --> 00:50:49,970
him out and Kent Kenneth Arnold himself

1248
00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:53,510
was a student also of coincidences he

1249
00:50:57,790 --> 00:50:55,370
used to carry around in his wallet

1250
00:50:59,160 --> 00:50:57,800
the Lincoln Kennedy coincidences you

1251
00:51:00,990 --> 00:50:59,170
know those right yeah

1252
00:51:02,549 --> 00:51:01,000
I got Kennedy had a secretary named

1253
00:51:05,670 --> 00:51:02,559
Lincoln and Lincoln had a secretary of

1254
00:51:08,370 --> 00:51:05,680
Kennedy and he was killed and Kennedy

1255
00:51:12,140 --> 00:51:08,380
was killed in a Lincoln right and

1256
00:51:14,190 --> 00:51:12,150
Lincoln was killed in Ford's Theater

1257
00:51:16,410 --> 00:51:14,200
anyways oldest of him

1258
00:51:18,990 --> 00:51:16,420
and Arnold carried that around he also

1259
00:51:20,579 --> 00:51:19,000
his own book which came out in 1952

1260
00:51:23,430 --> 00:51:20,589
called the coming of the saucers which

1261
00:51:25,049 --> 00:51:23,440
is about the [\h__\h] case he he never

1262
00:51:27,990 --> 00:51:25,059
autographed a copy of that for his

1263
00:51:33,180 --> 00:51:28,000
daughter Kim Arnold until November 22nd

1264
00:51:35,490 --> 00:51:33,190
1973 just to you know just to put it

1265
00:51:37,170 --> 00:51:35,500
into the pattern and and so Kim Arnold

1266
00:51:39,599 --> 00:51:37,180
actually sometimes makes the lecture

1267
00:51:41,160 --> 00:51:39,609
stuff at the UFO conferences and she

1268
00:51:43,289 --> 00:51:41,170
talks about all of that but the one

1269
00:51:45,210 --> 00:51:43,299
coincidence is she doesn't bring up his

1270
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:45,220
the coincidence of fredchristman being

1271
00:51:49,589 --> 00:51:47,770
such an important part of her father's

1272
00:51:52,170 --> 00:51:49,599
story also him being the grassy knoll

1273
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:52,180
shooter because I'll bet and I've sent

1274
00:51:56,430 --> 00:51:54,010
emails to try to find it's out but I'll

1275
00:51:58,140 --> 00:51:56,440
bet kim model doesn't know that just

1276
00:52:01,349 --> 00:51:58,150
like most Americans don't really know

1277
00:52:02,430 --> 00:52:01,359
that yeah Chrisman has been fingered as

1278
00:52:04,530 --> 00:52:02,440
a grassy knoll shooter and that's

1279
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:04,540
practically the government's point of

1280
00:52:10,170 --> 00:52:08,290
view huh yeah that's interesting

1281
00:52:11,460 --> 00:52:10,180
I mean a lot of people were getting down

1282
00:52:14,549 --> 00:52:11,470
kind of to the end of it but a lot of

1283
00:52:16,710 --> 00:52:14,559
people have this idea in their head or I

1284
00:52:19,349 --> 00:52:16,720
think it's kind of like a surface-level

1285
00:52:21,630 --> 00:52:19,359
conspiracy that you know Lincoln was

1286
00:52:24,089 --> 00:52:21,640
killed and in public and Kennedy was

1287
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:24,099
killed in public and it was done by are

1288
00:52:28,079 --> 00:52:25,930
done for the reasons that they were both

1289
00:52:31,289 --> 00:52:28,089
trying to mess with the currencies in

1290
00:52:32,970 --> 00:52:31,299
the country and trying to you know

1291
00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:32,980
loosen the stranglehold from

1292
00:52:37,260 --> 00:52:35,530
international bankers and it makes sense

1293
00:52:39,270 --> 00:52:37,270
it definitely does coming when you look

1294
00:52:41,220 --> 00:52:39,280
at the money always follow the money and

1295
00:52:42,450 --> 00:52:41,230
so you got to think that that plays a

1296
00:52:44,400 --> 00:52:42,460
role but that's not really the

1297
00:52:45,990 --> 00:52:44,410
conclusion for the reason of the

1298
00:52:48,510 --> 00:52:46,000
assassination that you come to is it

1299
00:52:51,170 --> 00:52:48,520
well no I don't actually I think what

1300
00:52:54,620 --> 00:52:51,180
happened with the reasons one of the

1301
00:52:58,289 --> 00:52:54,630
certainly anybody like Kennedy who was

1302
00:53:00,210 --> 00:52:58,299
was progressive and wanted the the best

1303
00:53:03,660 --> 00:53:00,220
democratic process is to prevail in his

1304
00:53:07,620 --> 00:53:03,670
country was at odds with the money

1305
00:53:09,260 --> 00:53:07,630
establishment but I might do is you know

1306
00:53:11,890 --> 00:53:09,270
they people hold up the there are

1307
00:53:14,109 --> 00:53:11,900
certain dollar bills that do not say

1308
00:53:16,269 --> 00:53:14,119
federal reserve on them and people hold

1309
00:53:17,859 --> 00:53:16,279
that up as proof that Kennedy was trying

1310
00:53:20,589 --> 00:53:17,869
to get us away from the Federal Reserve

1311
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:20,599
but the fact of the matter is that those

1312
00:53:27,309 --> 00:53:24,170
are promissory notes meant to retire the

1313
00:53:29,079 --> 00:53:27,319
debt of coins coins contain silver and

1314
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:29,089
the silver at one point because of the

1315
00:53:36,549 --> 00:53:31,490
price of the silver and the market was

1316
00:53:38,500 --> 00:53:36,559
was worth more than the coin so they

1317
00:53:40,750 --> 00:53:38,510
issued these promise they're you know

1318
00:53:42,250 --> 00:53:40,760
it's just basically to retire that

1319
00:53:45,370 --> 00:53:42,260
obligation and it takes silver out of

1320
00:53:48,069 --> 00:53:45,380
the coins so that that almost seems

1321
00:53:50,500 --> 00:53:48,079
contradictory that almost seems like you

1322
00:53:53,849 --> 00:53:50,510
know IV move towards more fiat currency

1323
00:53:56,710 --> 00:53:53,859
which would enslave the country more

1324
00:53:59,609 --> 00:53:56,720
right yeah well that's what I'm saying I

1325
00:54:03,690 --> 00:53:59,619
don't think you know if Kennedy was

1326
00:54:06,370 --> 00:54:03,700
certainly Kennedy was was opposed to a

1327
00:54:07,539 --> 00:54:06,380
secrecy and an oppressive government I

1328
00:54:09,089 --> 00:54:07,549
mean he had the example of the

1329
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:09,099
Communists that he always worked against

1330
00:54:15,819 --> 00:54:13,970
and so you know whatever was going on

1331
00:54:18,309 --> 00:54:15,829
between him and the Federal Reserve I'm

1332
00:54:20,109 --> 00:54:18,319
sure is worthy of study but I'm just at

1333
00:54:21,430 --> 00:54:20,119
that in that particular case I don't you

1334
00:54:23,440 --> 00:54:21,440
know I don't think those those dollar

1335
00:54:26,650 --> 00:54:23,450
bills prove that yeah you don't see that

1336
00:54:29,230 --> 00:54:26,660
as the necessary linkage yeah what you

1337
00:54:30,819 --> 00:54:29,240
do point out is the the contracts with

1338
00:54:32,829 --> 00:54:30,829
Boeing is that the reason you think he

1339
00:54:36,069 --> 00:54:32,839
was assassinated because we didn't talk

1340
00:54:39,519 --> 00:54:36,079
about the actual reasoning oh well

1341
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:39,529
Boeing yeah you know Chrisman also

1342
00:54:48,279 --> 00:54:42,650
worked for Boeing at one time another

1343
00:54:51,220 --> 00:54:48,289
interesting link but Kennedy remember

1344
00:54:53,049 --> 00:54:51,230
was reversing what was going on in

1345
00:54:55,539 --> 00:54:53,059
Vietnam because it was you know clearly

1346
00:54:58,510 --> 00:54:55,549
that that was the the wrong path for the

1347
00:55:01,240 --> 00:54:58,520
country the first thing that LBJ did

1348
00:55:04,269 --> 00:55:01,250
when he assumed office was to reverse

1349
00:55:06,730 --> 00:55:04,279
that process to reverse it up yeah it's

1350
00:55:08,890 --> 00:55:06,740
yeah to stopped Kennedy's de-escalation

1351
00:55:11,650 --> 00:55:08,900
but in the process of de-escalating of

1352
00:55:13,859 --> 00:55:11,660
course Bell Helicopter Boeing all the

1353
00:55:16,299 --> 00:55:13,869
arms manufacturers were taking big hits

1354
00:55:17,829 --> 00:55:16,309
it's the same story it's follow the

1355
00:55:21,970 --> 00:55:17,839
money just a different angle instead of

1356
00:55:23,260 --> 00:55:21,980
it being so huge as to be a slap against

1357
00:55:24,760 --> 00:55:23,270
the Federal Reserve you know you can

1358
00:55:25,660 --> 00:55:24,770
think of it as I mean Boeing's got a

1359
00:55:27,460 --> 00:55:25,670
shady past

1360
00:55:29,859 --> 00:55:27,470
I don't see why they would have any

1361
00:55:31,000 --> 00:55:29,869
problem hiring an assassin to kill the

1362
00:55:32,859 --> 00:55:31,010
president if they weren't getting their

1363
00:55:34,509 --> 00:55:32,869
contracts I mean I could see Halliburton

1364
00:55:35,829 --> 00:55:34,519
doing something similar if Obama for

1365
00:55:37,329 --> 00:55:35,839
whatever reason was to be like all right

1366
00:55:39,130 --> 00:55:37,339
everybody come home right now

1367
00:55:41,049 --> 00:55:39,140
right I think he'd probably be dead too

1368
00:55:42,910 --> 00:55:41,059
but of course when I went Obama got

1369
00:55:45,250 --> 00:55:42,920
elected I said to friends you know I was

1370
00:55:46,420 --> 00:55:45,260
like hey this guy's talking bold I felt

1371
00:55:48,160 --> 00:55:46,430
like Hillary was supposed to be the

1372
00:55:49,900 --> 00:55:48,170
establishment candidate and maybe he won

1373
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:49,910
out because of the internet and I said

1374
00:55:53,890 --> 00:55:51,170
the only way to know for sure if he's

1375
00:55:56,230 --> 00:55:53,900
legit as if he gets assassinated it's a

1376
00:55:58,450 --> 00:55:56,240
shame and it's a very sad and cynical

1377
00:56:00,069 --> 00:55:58,460
view but I mean here we are well I said

1378
00:56:03,609 --> 00:56:00,079
something actually kind of similar to

1379
00:56:07,390 --> 00:56:03,619
that in a blog from my publisher of

1380
00:56:09,519 --> 00:56:07,400
feral house which publishes JFK before

1381
00:56:11,380 --> 00:56:09,529
the election I said it an assassination

1382
00:56:13,359 --> 00:56:11,390
is going to somehow factor into this

1383
00:56:15,819 --> 00:56:13,369
election and it was shortly after that

1384
00:56:18,039 --> 00:56:15,829
came out when the Libyan ambassador was

1385
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:18,049
assassinated and that hung like the

1386
00:56:24,130 --> 00:56:20,450
sword of Damocles over Obama's campaign

1387
00:56:27,160 --> 00:56:24,140
until the word went down and and Romney

1388
00:56:28,569 --> 00:56:27,170
didn't use it to any great effect but

1389
00:56:33,069 --> 00:56:28,579
they could have had a large impact that

1390
00:56:34,599 --> 00:56:33,079
assassination you know yeah man well and

1391
00:56:36,099 --> 00:56:34,609
this before we get going I mean this

1392
00:56:38,650 --> 00:56:36,109
seems like a pretty basic question but

1393
00:56:40,720 --> 00:56:38,660
you've been a professional archiver for

1394
00:56:42,700 --> 00:56:40,730
many years and a thorough and leading

1395
00:56:45,370 --> 00:56:42,710
researcher in conspiracies how would you

1396
00:56:47,140 --> 00:56:45,380
educate someone in the art of taking a

1397
00:56:48,819 --> 00:56:47,150
curiosity they may have about an event

1398
00:56:51,099 --> 00:56:48,829
and being able to actually do the

1399
00:56:58,809 --> 00:56:51,109
research into things that are thought to

1400
00:57:02,230 --> 00:56:58,819
be unattainable so how to be a

1401
00:57:04,180 --> 00:57:02,240
researcher there's a chapter and the

1402
00:57:05,529 --> 00:57:04,190
book is called pair of politics not to

1403
00:57:07,839 --> 00:57:05,539
be confused with the current Kindle book

1404
00:57:09,190 --> 00:57:07,849
popular pair of Parliament but does I

1405
00:57:10,720 --> 00:57:09,200
have a whole article about how to do

1406
00:57:11,680 --> 00:57:10,730
research through the Freedom of

1407
00:57:15,190 --> 00:57:11,690
Information Act

1408
00:57:16,930 --> 00:57:15,200
it's like anything else yeah it takes

1409
00:57:19,930 --> 00:57:16,940
patience and time and some intelligence

1410
00:57:22,870 --> 00:57:19,940
you know if you if you know of an

1411
00:57:25,420 --> 00:57:22,880
incident get the names investigate the

1412
00:57:27,519 --> 00:57:25,430
lives start making the connections if

1413
00:57:29,349 --> 00:57:27,529
there are documents to be had you got to

1414
00:57:32,680 --> 00:57:29,359
locate the repositories that have them

1415
00:57:35,799 --> 00:57:32,690
that's a good how do you do that well

1416
00:57:38,460 --> 00:57:35,809
you got so many more tools now online to

1417
00:57:41,730 --> 00:57:38,470
do it you know the

1418
00:57:44,010 --> 00:57:41,740
I ever did when I that is true there's

1419
00:57:46,500 --> 00:57:44,020
also more [\h__\h] out there right yeah

1420
00:57:52,230 --> 00:57:46,510
the signal to noise ratio is worse than

1421
00:57:53,970 --> 00:57:52,240
it used to be but use your archives

1422
00:57:55,470 --> 00:57:53,980
you know primary sources are the best

1423
00:57:57,620 --> 00:57:55,480
but primary sources are the things that

1424
00:58:01,260 --> 00:57:57,630
they cover up you know with the most

1425
00:58:04,440 --> 00:58:01,270
passion you know the smoking gun right

1426
00:58:05,760 --> 00:58:04,450
the you know the document that proves

1427
00:58:07,380 --> 00:58:05,770
one thing or another is likely to have

1428
00:58:09,630 --> 00:58:07,390
been destroyed so a lot of times all you

1429
00:58:13,410 --> 00:58:09,640
have is implications and inferences and

1430
00:58:14,940 --> 00:58:13,420
the approach that I've taken and this

1431
00:58:17,330 --> 00:58:14,950
and it comes out of my association

1432
00:58:20,460 --> 00:58:17,340
actually with Timothy Leary whose

1433
00:58:22,460 --> 00:58:20,470
philosophy was was one of pure

1434
00:58:25,260 --> 00:58:22,470
intelligence of gathering data and

1435
00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:25,270
letting the data speak to you do not

1436
00:58:30,300 --> 00:58:29,050
look at it from you know radical posture

1437
00:58:32,849 --> 00:58:30,310
that you're a leftist and you're gonna

1438
00:58:34,560 --> 00:58:32,859
expose or you're a right winger and

1439
00:58:36,270 --> 00:58:34,570
you're going to expose the government

1440
00:58:38,280 --> 00:58:36,280
that way just look at the data and then

1441
00:58:39,810 --> 00:58:38,290
what is the data telling you so in order

1442
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:39,820
to do that you have to collect the data

1443
00:58:43,140 --> 00:58:41,530
so you just collect it you collected

1444
00:58:44,700 --> 00:58:43,150
from every source you don't and it

1445
00:58:46,859 --> 00:58:44,710
doesn't matter how outrageous it is

1446
00:58:51,839 --> 00:58:46,869
because at some point you're gonna have

1447
00:58:54,060 --> 00:58:51,849
to do a triangulation of the data and

1448
00:58:57,630 --> 00:58:54,070
whatever speaking the loudest to you

1449
00:59:00,750 --> 00:58:57,640
that's what's likely to be as true as is

1450
00:59:02,670 --> 00:59:00,760
anything you can research well there

1451
00:59:04,079 --> 00:59:02,680
there you go that's a tough row to hoe I

1452
00:59:05,490 --> 00:59:04,089
mean it's very hard for people who like

1453
00:59:09,750 --> 00:59:05,500
you said I've been doing archives work

1454
00:59:11,550 --> 00:59:09,760
for 25 years you know I it's my job

1455
00:59:14,460 --> 00:59:11,560
forty hours a week to do stuff like that

1456
00:59:16,349 --> 00:59:14,470
usually on much more banal topics that

1457
00:59:17,520 --> 00:59:16,359
does put you in a pretty unique position

1458
00:59:19,770 --> 00:59:17,530
and I would say to anybody who's

1459
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:19,780
standing there on a treadmill listening

1460
00:59:25,500 --> 00:59:22,810
to this you know put out some infimum of

1461
00:59:27,060 --> 00:59:25,510
information act requests I feel like my

1462
00:59:28,740 --> 00:59:27,070
hands are titled I love doing the show I

1463
00:59:30,210 --> 00:59:28,750
love talking to the researchers but I'm

1464
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:30,220
just like me I kind of like to get out

1465
00:59:36,300 --> 00:59:33,450
there and do something dig something up

1466
00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:36,310
it's exhilarating particularly you know

1467
00:59:39,750 --> 00:59:38,050
if you have questions you know I you

1468
00:59:42,870 --> 00:59:39,760
know I was five years old when Kennedy

1469
00:59:45,930 --> 00:59:42,880
was assassinated and the country was

1470
00:59:47,490 --> 00:59:45,940
screwed up ever since that point funny a

1471
00:59:49,140 --> 00:59:47,500
little interesting anecdote about that

1472
00:59:50,370 --> 00:59:49,150
as I was uh having dinner with my

1473
00:59:51,839 --> 00:59:50,380
parents the other day I'm telling him

1474
00:59:53,700 --> 00:59:51,849
about upcoming shows I mentioned

1475
00:59:56,069 --> 00:59:53,710
you in the Kennedy assassination my dad

1476
00:59:57,150 --> 00:59:56,079
was 13 I you know I asked him oh hey do

1477
00:59:58,529 --> 00:59:57,160
you remember where you were when that

1478
01:00:00,239 --> 00:59:58,539
happening he's like oh yeah he's like

1479
01:00:02,910 --> 01:00:00,249
well first everybody does but secondly

1480
01:00:04,170 --> 01:00:02,920
he's he said I had a paper route and on

1481
01:00:06,180 --> 01:00:04,180
that day I was going around delivering

1482
01:00:07,499 --> 01:00:06,190
papers and every person who I did gave a

1483
01:00:09,569 --> 01:00:07,509
paper to would come out and be like did

1484
01:00:11,640 --> 01:00:09,579
you hear what happened no what no what

1485
01:00:14,700 --> 01:00:11,650
maybe like Kennedy's been shot

1486
01:00:18,420 --> 01:00:14,710
my god I can't see my dad going door to

1487
01:00:22,079 --> 01:00:18,430
door acting like he had no idea get the

1488
01:00:25,079 --> 01:00:22,089
news from so many different people in

1489
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:25,089
contrast to 1977 when they finally

1490
01:00:29,849 --> 01:00:27,130
concluded was a conspiracy and it did

1491
01:00:31,469 --> 01:00:29,859
make a single front page headline of

1492
01:00:36,420 --> 01:00:31,479
course back in the back of the papers

1493
01:00:37,890 --> 01:00:36,430
and you know at that point but this you

1494
01:00:39,359 --> 01:00:37,900
know I mean that's not even the end of

1495
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:39,369
the story but it's closer to the truth

1496
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:41,410
of the story than it ever was when your

1497
01:00:45,059 --> 01:00:43,690
father was a kid right but it was still

1498
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:45,069
you know my god the president was shot

1499
01:00:49,979 --> 01:00:47,410
this is the world's falling apart you

1500
01:00:52,109 --> 01:00:49,989
know and clearly they they came up with

1501
01:00:54,539 --> 01:00:52,119
a Warren Commission thing just to try to

1502
01:00:56,819 --> 01:00:54,549
shut people up and I have an official

1503
01:00:59,759 --> 01:00:56,829
conclusion that you can fall back on but

1504
01:01:00,569 --> 01:00:59,769
that you know nobody was it's an easy

1505
01:01:02,819 --> 01:01:00,579
with anybody

1506
01:01:04,650 --> 01:01:02,829
one other thing one little fun thing I

1507
01:01:07,079 --> 01:01:04,660
wanted to throw in before I let you go

1508
01:01:08,459 --> 01:01:07,089
I'm not keeping you too long that one

1509
01:01:09,479 --> 01:01:08,469
event that happened this past week I

1510
01:01:11,339 --> 01:01:09,489
haven't been able to talk to anybody

1511
01:01:13,650 --> 01:01:11,349
about it or get anyone's thoughts on it

1512
01:01:16,200 --> 01:01:13,660
and you seem like as good a guest as any

1513
01:01:17,729 --> 01:01:16,210
and that event is the meteor crash in

1514
01:01:20,969 --> 01:01:17,739
Russia and I saw a video that you had

1515
01:01:23,219 --> 01:01:20,979
posted on I think the steam shovel press

1516
01:01:25,529 --> 01:01:23,229
facebook page that showed what looked

1517
01:01:28,370 --> 01:01:25,539
like a UFO busting up that meteor in the

1518
01:01:32,069 --> 01:01:28,380
air what did you think of that video

1519
01:01:33,809 --> 01:01:32,079
well you know that's kind of why I put

1520
01:01:35,489 --> 01:01:33,819
it out there what do you think of it I

1521
01:01:38,130 --> 01:01:35,499
thought it was interesting if you

1522
01:01:40,559 --> 01:01:38,140
consider the line of thought that that

1523
01:01:42,299 --> 01:01:40,569
ETS are here to help us and sort of

1524
01:01:43,680 --> 01:01:42,309
guide us and keep us from blowing

1525
01:01:45,989 --> 01:01:43,690
ourselves up because there's a lot in

1526
01:01:48,690 --> 01:01:45,999
ties in with the nuclear facilities and

1527
01:01:51,150 --> 01:01:48,700
UFOs hovering over them it seems kind of

1528
01:01:54,420 --> 01:01:51,160
it seems like it fits the bill that a

1529
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:54,430
UFO would smash up a meteor to make

1530
01:01:59,130 --> 01:01:56,170
smaller pieces so it doesn't completely

1531
01:02:01,259 --> 01:01:59,140
destroy a big chunk of the of the earth

1532
01:02:03,460 --> 01:02:01,269
well you know that other asteroid that

1533
01:02:05,920 --> 01:02:03,470
was coming close at the same time God

1534
01:02:08,140 --> 01:02:05,930
then got closer to the earth than most

1535
01:02:09,430 --> 01:02:08,150
of our communication satellites yeah

1536
01:02:11,230 --> 01:02:09,440
what's the deal with that I thought they

1537
01:02:13,570 --> 01:02:11,240
could see these things coming from a

1538
01:02:16,540 --> 01:02:13,580
year away you know they're all happening

1539
01:02:18,640 --> 01:02:16,550
at once - right right and this would

1540
01:02:20,230 --> 01:02:18,650
have been just two months ago this would

1541
01:02:22,750 --> 01:02:20,240
have been a whole different mess

1542
01:02:25,060 --> 01:02:22,760
December 21st 2012 we hold it from mess

1543
01:02:26,800 --> 01:02:25,070
but yeah but the point is though that

1544
01:02:28,690 --> 01:02:26,810
there is a level of secrecy that is

1545
01:02:32,080 --> 01:02:28,700
attended to everything having to do with

1546
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:32,090
advanced technology and space travel and

1547
01:02:37,570 --> 01:02:34,730
you know there's the moon hoax theory

1548
01:02:40,330 --> 01:02:37,580
and all that other stuff it's it's it's

1549
01:02:41,770 --> 01:02:40,340
there and you know reading NASA press

1550
01:02:43,120 --> 01:02:41,780
releases doesn't get you closer to

1551
01:02:45,910 --> 01:02:43,130
understanding what actually happened I

1552
01:02:48,370 --> 01:02:45,920
agree with that well Kent I mean that

1553
01:02:50,410 --> 01:02:48,380
about wraps up our time together I had a

1554
01:02:54,430 --> 01:02:50,420
great time let me see one more thing

1555
01:02:57,430 --> 01:02:54,440
sure on the theme of popular para

1556
01:02:58,570 --> 01:02:57,440
politics of course you again this is the

1557
01:03:01,420 --> 01:02:58,580
50th anniversary of the JFK

1558
01:03:02,680 --> 01:03:01,430
assassination and so far only two movies

1559
01:03:05,710 --> 01:03:02,690
have been announced that have been

1560
01:03:08,740 --> 01:03:05,720
coming out of the fall about JFK one of

1561
01:03:10,750 --> 01:03:08,750
them is with Tom Hanks this is called

1562
01:03:15,220 --> 01:03:10,760
parkland and you know that's gonna be

1563
01:03:16,450 --> 01:03:15,230
that's gonna be Forrest Gump right it's

1564
01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:16,460
about what happens at the Parkland

1565
01:03:20,650 --> 01:03:19,010
Hospital the other one and I don't know

1566
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:20,660
this much about it but I know it's going

1567
01:03:25,630 --> 01:03:22,490
to be the movie to watch

1568
01:03:27,849 --> 01:03:25,640
it's called Dallas and Wonderland and

1569
01:03:30,010 --> 01:03:27,859
one of the co riders on it is Adam Park

1570
01:03:33,099 --> 01:03:30,020
Reid who's my publisher runs Farrell

1571
01:03:34,329 --> 01:03:33,109
house and James Shelby downards wasn't

1572
01:03:36,849 --> 01:03:34,339
going to be in it and it's gonna be all

1573
01:03:38,530 --> 01:03:36,859
about various theories and things it's

1574
01:03:40,270 --> 01:03:38,540
gonna sounds like I hardly gonna do it

1575
01:03:41,950 --> 01:03:40,280
it's a mystery to me it's gonna be a

1576
01:03:43,690 --> 01:03:41,960
fast-moving so if you're looking you

1577
01:03:46,210 --> 01:03:43,700
know November comes around and you're

1578
01:03:48,040 --> 01:03:46,220
not a Dallas where you should be if

1579
01:03:50,050 --> 01:03:48,050
you're a Kennedy assassination person at

1580
01:03:52,210 --> 01:03:50,060
all we should all converge on Dallas in

1581
01:03:53,470 --> 01:03:52,220
the 50th anniversary what event is going

1582
01:03:55,870 --> 01:03:53,480
on cuz let's tell people because I think

1583
01:03:58,510 --> 01:03:55,880
people should you know start getting

1584
01:04:00,070 --> 01:03:58,520
involved in some way yeah people are

1585
01:04:01,540 --> 01:04:00,080
converging on Dallas I mean there's a

1586
01:04:03,910 --> 01:04:01,550
lot is that going down you see meant

1587
01:04:05,650 --> 01:04:03,920
earlier protesting in Dallas right well

1588
01:04:07,990 --> 01:04:05,660
the Coalition on political

1589
01:04:10,990 --> 01:04:08,000
assassinations in Washington DC you can

1590
01:04:13,870 --> 01:04:11,000
find them in a web search the the the

1591
01:04:15,900 --> 01:04:13,880
guy who runs that is John jugs find him

1592
01:04:18,299 --> 01:04:15,910
alive search they have

1593
01:04:20,309 --> 01:04:18,309
talking to authorities in Dallas because

1594
01:04:22,500 --> 01:04:20,319
the authorities in Dallas have been

1595
01:04:25,500 --> 01:04:22,510
discussing some kinds of ways to put a

1596
01:04:27,059 --> 01:04:25,510
clamp down on what's happening there

1597
01:04:29,220 --> 01:04:27,069
this year of all years you know they

1598
01:04:31,020 --> 01:04:29,230
have a ceremony there every year and a

1599
01:04:32,250 --> 01:04:31,030
protest there every year but this year

1600
01:04:35,640 --> 01:04:32,260
they're kind of worried about it so

1601
01:04:37,200 --> 01:04:35,650
judge has been talking to Dallas

1602
01:04:38,339 --> 01:04:37,210
authorities about you know what's really

1603
01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:38,349
going to happen if they're negotiating

1604
01:04:42,660 --> 01:04:40,450
for you know people not getting their

1605
01:04:44,670 --> 01:04:42,670
heads beat in there or whatever so

1606
01:04:46,940 --> 01:04:44,680
that's what I would recommend to people

1607
01:04:49,140 --> 01:04:46,950
look up Committee on political

1608
01:04:50,700 --> 01:04:49,150
assassinations with John judge and you

1609
01:04:52,620 --> 01:04:50,710
go to the front page and it will spell

1610
01:04:54,720 --> 01:04:52,630
out exactly where people are going to be

1611
01:04:58,740 --> 01:04:54,730
in Dallas and that'll be a November

1612
01:05:01,470 --> 01:04:58,750
right yeah whatever 22nd nice yeah cool

1613
01:05:02,970 --> 01:05:01,480
well I also want you to take a minute to

1614
01:05:04,980 --> 01:05:02,980
let the people know where they can catch

1615
01:05:06,900 --> 01:05:04,990
up on your latest works and keep up with

1616
01:05:09,809 --> 01:05:06,910
you and steam shovel press on the web

1617
01:05:12,180 --> 01:05:09,819
well steam shovel press Facebook is

1618
01:05:14,430 --> 01:05:12,190
probably the best thing you know I just

1619
01:05:17,039 --> 01:05:14,440
really kind of just got up on Facebook

1620
01:05:18,750 --> 01:05:17,049
and you have having a lot of fun posting

1621
01:05:20,190 --> 01:05:18,760
things there in ways I couldn't do

1622
01:05:22,069 --> 01:05:20,200
before but there's also steam shovel

1623
01:05:24,630 --> 01:05:22,079
press.com

1624
01:05:28,140 --> 01:05:24,640
the website which I now occasionally

1625
01:05:30,539 --> 01:05:28,150
update and one of the one of the things

1626
01:05:32,519 --> 01:05:30,549
on that website actually is a video of a

1627
01:05:34,140 --> 01:05:32,529
lecture I did once in the Mojave that

1628
01:05:37,410 --> 01:05:34,150
has to deal with the comic book artist

1629
01:05:40,950 --> 01:05:37,420
Jack Kirby who among other things had a

1630
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:40,960
strong role in what happens in this

1631
01:05:43,710 --> 01:05:41,770
movie Argo

1632
01:05:46,559 --> 01:05:43,720
although Kirby's name isn't mentioned

1633
01:05:48,299 --> 01:05:46,569
and anytime you see anything by Marvel

1634
01:05:50,099 --> 01:05:48,309
Comics they only ever mentioned his name

1635
01:05:51,809 --> 01:05:50,109
at all he's only created every one of

1636
01:05:54,089 --> 01:05:51,819
those trademark properties that are

1637
01:05:55,589 --> 01:05:54,099
making billions of dollars it's a you

1638
01:05:57,510 --> 01:05:55,599
know Kirby's one of the finest comic

1639
01:06:00,870 --> 01:05:57,520
book artists ever took up pencil to a

1640
01:06:03,359 --> 01:06:00,880
page and is his errors do not see a

1641
01:06:04,559 --> 01:06:03,369
penny of that so that's a conspiracy I

1642
01:06:06,269 --> 01:06:04,569
like it for that kind of thing so you

1643
01:06:08,400 --> 01:06:06,279
can order that through the website and

1644
01:06:11,099 --> 01:06:08,410
that is something I learned from from

1645
01:06:13,740 --> 01:06:11,109
you in in popular pair of politics and

1646
01:06:16,349 --> 01:06:13,750
then I went and researched it a little

1647
01:06:19,109 --> 01:06:16,359
bit but I guess Jack Kirby was working

1648
01:06:20,940 --> 01:06:19,119
for Stanley Stanley was his editor and

1649
01:06:23,370 --> 01:06:20,950
just was like oh these are great let me

1650
01:06:26,010 --> 01:06:23,380
take these and now we have Stan Lee is

1651
01:06:29,050 --> 01:06:26,020
the famous creator of all Marvel

1652
01:06:30,910 --> 01:06:29,060
superheroes that's that's [\h__\h] up Stan

1653
01:06:32,920 --> 01:06:30,920
is nothing he did nothing nothing

1654
01:06:35,260 --> 01:06:32,930
nothing nothing yeah it's statistically

1655
01:06:38,380 --> 01:06:35,270
irrelevant whatever was he did Jack

1656
01:06:39,820 --> 01:06:38,390
Kirby created all that stuff man it's a

1657
01:06:42,580 --> 01:06:39,830
crime you know and it's another

1658
01:06:45,490 --> 01:06:42,590
corporate crime you know there are many

1659
01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:45,500
right so anyway you have a lecture about

1660
01:06:49,150 --> 01:06:46,490
that that you can get through the

1661
01:06:51,130 --> 01:06:49,160
substantial press comm so the Kindle

1662
01:06:53,800 --> 01:06:51,140
book is called popular pair of politics

1663
01:06:56,200 --> 01:06:53,810
if you don't have a Kindle that you can

1664
01:06:58,720 --> 01:06:56,210
download software that gives you the

1665
01:07:01,990 --> 01:06:58,730
ability to read the book on your

1666
01:07:04,390 --> 01:07:02,000
computer so and you know the book is

1667
01:07:06,550 --> 01:07:04,400
cheap too because it it's not really a

1668
01:07:10,930 --> 01:07:06,560
book it's a Kindle the current the book

1669
01:07:12,280 --> 01:07:10,940
out there the actual book that you you

1670
01:07:15,820 --> 01:07:12,290
can purchase at a bookstore

1671
01:07:17,560 --> 01:07:15,830
it's called JFK and UFO and it's all

1672
01:07:20,470 --> 01:07:17,570
about what we've been talking about many

1673
01:07:21,820 --> 01:07:20,480
more connections I never do it justice I

1674
01:07:23,470 --> 01:07:21,830
always feel even after the best of

1675
01:07:25,600 --> 01:07:23,480
interviews I always you know God I

1676
01:07:28,180 --> 01:07:25,610
didn't say there's just a ton of

1677
01:07:30,850 --> 01:07:28,190
information in that book and so I

1678
01:07:32,940 --> 01:07:30,860
recommend that to your readers then I

1679
01:07:34,180 --> 01:07:32,950
think I pretty much covers the basis

1680
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:34,190
excellent

1681
01:07:39,520 --> 01:07:36,170
there's a gmail account at this website

1682
01:07:41,950 --> 01:07:39,530
if you contact me directly very cool and

1683
01:07:43,870 --> 01:07:41,960
I mean I'm so happy Adam go rightly put

1684
01:07:45,490 --> 01:07:43,880
us in touch been a real pleasure your

1685
01:07:47,650 --> 01:07:45,500
wealth of knowledge and information I

1686
01:07:50,500 --> 01:07:47,660
respect the painstaking monotonous job

1687
01:07:52,150 --> 01:07:50,510
of being a true researcher and you know

1688
01:07:53,830 --> 01:07:52,160
you along with plenty others deserve all

1689
01:07:55,180 --> 01:07:53,840
the respect in the world so thank you

1690
01:07:57,820 --> 01:07:55,190
sir and keep fighting the good fight

1691
01:08:01,660 --> 01:07:57,830
well thank you thank you alrighty have a

1692
01:08:03,760 --> 01:08:01,670
good one all right thank you like thanks

1693
01:08:05,530 --> 01:08:03,770
for listening people that was Ken Thomas

1694
01:08:07,210 --> 01:08:05,540
I'm Gregg Carl wood and this has been

1695
01:08:09,010 --> 01:08:07,220
another episode of the higher side chats

1696
01:08:11,020 --> 01:08:09,020
if there's a guest you'd like to see on

1697
01:08:12,430 --> 01:08:11,030
the show just Facebook me or you can

1698
01:08:15,370 --> 01:08:12,440
email me at the higher side chats at

1699
01:08:17,380 --> 01:08:15,380
gmail.com please share and review the

1700
01:08:19,540 --> 01:08:17,390
show it is the new currency of the

1701
01:08:21,550 --> 01:08:19,550
digital era and I really appreciate that

1702
01:08:24,070 --> 01:08:21,560
if you by chance have any real currency

1703
01:08:27,700 --> 01:08:24,080
left please check out my t-shirts at

1704
01:08:29,980 --> 01:08:27,710
conspiracies nets and a new thg should

1705
01:08:32,230 --> 01:08:29,990
be available every Sunday so please keep